Fantasy Draft Discussion.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Nothing to back up my claims you say ?

 

I guess Ogden is a liar because he knew 15 years down the road you were going to call it into question so he had to say he played him just for controversy. That is pathetic lol..

 

And yet delectably funny.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Haha so now the Bills are against you too Favre...things just keep getting worse lol.

 

 

Let me hop in my time machine and go back to 1998 and record the snaps lol.

 

What proof do you have that what I say is incorrect, because he is listed on a depth chart as a LDE ? Then you say he moves, so now he does move. And then to cover yourself you say but not that much. Do you remember how many snaps he played that game ?

 

LEts lowball and say you are right and it was only ten snaps (it wasnt) Reggie still did not get a sack so would I then be incorrect ? No I would still be correct given the sample size albeit a small one.

 

Since neither of us can prove the snaps then we dont know how many he did play there, but yes keep insulting my memory because that means they did not play....

 

So you have proved nothing and have not disproved anything I have said....what did you accomplish ?

 

Saying emphatically that Ogden shut down White after playing MAYBE a handful of snaps against him is disingenuous on your part. A large and mighty stretching of the truth.

 

Although, I doubt that was your play from the beginning. The more likely scenario is you really didn't know, you read a couple biased Ravens blogs, and just regurgitated their words believing them as fact.

 

I DON'T know the answers to my own questions, which is why I posed them to you. How often did LE Reggie White line up on right side? How many times did he go 1-on-1 with Ogden?

 

I want to know. I WANT you to provide us with information to inform us of these things.

 

I don't have the answers. I haven't claimed to know them. And it might be time you man up and admit you don't either. You were more than a little off base in your analysis and are or were probably very biased towards your own player who you drafted way early in this game... It happens. I am biased towards Reggie, although this thread doesn't exhibit it much being that all I am saying is pure 100% fact.

 

He was a LDE, who started there during the Ravens game, as I provided pictures for you showing him at LE, showing him dominating your line (but true, not getting sacks).

 

You on the other hand, can not produce one picture of Ogden and Reggie battling in the trenches. Granted, this doesn't prove it did or didn't happen... But it sure would go a long way in making you look less foolish.

 

 

Nothing to back up my claims you say ?

 

I guess Ogden is a liar because he knew 15 years down the road you were going to call it into question so he had to say he played him just for controversy. That is pathetic lol..

 

And yet delectably funny.

 

I didn't say he was a liar. But to say what he did... All he has to do is line up against Reggie one time. One.

 

ZOMG, OGDEN SHUT DOWN ARGUABLY THE BEST PASSER OF ALL TIME.... for one play.

 

All I am and have been asking for is evidence of the true domination you claim happened that day. Beyond the fact that Reggie doesn't play across from Ogden naturally and beyond sack numbers. I would love to see pictures of Ogden smothering Reggie into the dirt... That would help you a lot.

 

Although, I don't think you will find any. Searching for "Reggie White Jonathan Ogden" in google images brings back more results of men posing in semi-pornographic photos than it does picture of Ogden and White battling each other man to man.

 

Which also explains why you refuse to acknowledge that request of mine.. You just... got a little distracted.

 

Maybe once... just once... You are wrong.

Edited May 14, 2013 by Favre4Ever

[Thanatos 2,847]

[AllYouNeedIsLovie 377]

[Bucman 891]

Jerry Rice, Cris Carter, James Lofton

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Find me a website that keeps play by plays from 1998 and I would be more than happy to show you. Until then asking for a snap count is not really a feasible request.

 

Second, this starts out as they never played, to the well they did play, to well now show me something saying they played X amount of snaps. Is there anything else you would like ?

 

Since you google imaged it already I would assume you have found nothing so for me to search that avenue would be fruitless hence the reason you are basing a counter argument against it. Smart play on your part I will give you that.

 

And you say I cant produce one picture proving it although you go on to later agree it does not prove anything, just makes me less foolish. When in this argument did I say something that was not true.

 

And that is rich telling someone they can not admit they are wrong....coming from the guy who is renowned in TGP for strawman arguments and then telling people what their agument is and arguing that....

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Find me a website that keeps play by plays from 1998 and I would be more than happy to show you. Until then asking for a snap count is not really a feasible request.

 

Second, this starts out as they never played, to the well they did play, to well now show me something saying they played X amount of snaps. Is there anything else you would like ?

 

Since you google imaged it already I would assume you have found nothing so for me to search that avenue would be fruitless hence the reason you are basing a counter argument against it. Smart play on your part I will give you that.

 

And you say I cant produce one picture proving it although you go on to later agree it does not prove anything, just makes me less foolish. When in this argument did I say something that was not true.

 

And that is rich telling someone they can not admit they are wrong....coming from the guy who is renowned in TGP for strawman arguments and then telling people what their agument is and arguing that....

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I really wanted Adderley, Atwater and Lofton these last 10 picks have been brutal

[Turry 755]

Reggie white + Chris Doleman >>>any OT

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

Jerry Rice, Cris Carter, James Lofton

Bailey, Adderley and Wilson do not care about those pathetic receivers.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

It makes you wonder about matchups here all teams definitely have their strengths. I wonder which teams will even out after the picks settle down to fill out the roster.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Find me a website that keeps play by plays from 1998 and I would be more than happy to show you. Until then asking for a snap count is not really a feasible request.

 

Second, this starts out as they never played, to the well they did play, to well now show me something saying they played X amount of snaps. Is there anything else you would like ?

 

Since you google imaged it already I would assume you have found nothing so for me to search that avenue would be fruitless hence the reason you are basing a counter argument against it. Smart play on your part I will give you that.

 

And you say I cant produce one picture proving it although you go on to later agree it does not prove anything, just makes me less foolish. When in this argument did I say something that was not true.

 

And that is rich telling someone they can not admit they are wrong....coming from the guy who is renowned in TGP for strawman arguments and then telling people what their agument is and arguing that....

 

Sean was the only one who said they never met. It was a mistake, I am sure.. And one he would admit to if he were on. Get over it... He can make a mistake, even if you can't.

 

I trust in my ability to find things better than I do yours. If I could find them, I certainly would not ask you to look.

 

I only briefly searched one page, got creeped out by the results that weren't what I was looking for and left quickly. Just because my search didn't come up with anything, doesn't mean you can't find one... Look deeper, look harder...

 

I have already admitted I don't have the answers... I don't. I have basic knowledge of the game that you don't, sure... But I don't have snap counts. I don't know if Ogden played Reggie without help from a G or TE.

 

Thus, I find it quite humorous... When you decide to copy verbatim another member and the discussions we had (Zack)-- when what you are copying has no relevance here in the slightest.

 

There are no straw men here... I have already admitted, multiple times, I don't have the answers. Yet, you continue to try to save face. You didn't know Reggie played LE, who cares? If you decide to just say what everyone here knows, that you weren't aware of what position Reggie played, or even that you were greatly exaggerating when saying Ogden shut down Reggie White... The whole thing would be null and void. Instead, you carry on like you are infallible.

 

Instead, you take the away valuable time from not only me but yourself as well so that I can take you down a notch or ten.

 

It would be funny if it wasn't so very sad.

 

/myinvolvementinthisparticulardiscussioninthisparticularthreadatthisparticularmoment

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Haha you took me down a notch did you ? Go you, you are so great lol.

 

And telling me what I think/knew already is not telling me what I knew and then arguing that is not what is going on here ? Yeah I needed Zack to point that out for me, he PM'ed me when you werent looking to say that.

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

I love seeing my name mentioned. Gives me a sense of importance.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Air got himself a steal...

 

Along with two former Packer teammates - Fuzzy Thurston and Forrest Gregg - Adderley is one of only three players in pro football history to play on six World Championship teams. However, in a revised edition of Instant Replay, a memoir by former Packer teammate Jerry Kramer, Adderley is quoted as saying, "I'm the only man with a Dallas Cowboys Super Bowl ring who doesn't wear it. I'm a Green Bay Packer."

[BLUE 1,026]

Unless I'm missing something the two never met on the field and even if they did as great as Reggie was a Packer his prime was in Philly where over an 8 year period he had 124 sacks in 120 games. That's 15.5 per year. To average that over almost a fucking decade is retarded. Reggie White in his prime could not be stopped by any one man.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WhitRe00.htm

 

Can't find any record of him playing the Ravens. I'm probably over looking something though so if you find it I wouldn't be surprised.

 

Erik Williams from the Cowboys had some battles with Reggie White and held his own against him back in the day, IIRC.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Erik Williams from the Cowboys had some battles with Reggie White and held his own against him back in the day, IIRC.

 

 

You're lucky....without this, it would have never happened.

[seanbrock 1,684]

a DE can still make a pretty big impact on a game with like 1 tackle on the stat sheet. Guys like Reggie White get doubled and free up other guys, but sometimes just getting pressure without sacking a QB can cause INT's.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

a DE can still make a pretty big impact on a game with like 1 tackle on the stat sheet. Guys like Reggie White get doubled and free up other guys, but sometimes just getting pressure without sacking a QB can cause INT's.

 

This I can agree with. That said when you have a line full of all pros you would need two reggie whites to make a big difference. If the rest of your line can handle themselves in one on one situations than it is really not relevant to who frees up who as the other guys on the line can win one on ones with lesser DE's.

 

And that is sometimes for the int's. If you have a good QB it will likely not matter all that much whether pressured or not.

[Turry 755]

This I can agree with. That said when you have a line full of all pros you would need two reggie whites to make a big difference. If the rest of your line can handle themselves in one on one situations than it is really not relevant to who frees up who as the other guys on the line can win one on ones with lesser DE's.

 

And that is sometimes for the int's. If you have a good QB it will likely not matter all that much whether pressured or not.

You don't need two Reggie Whites you just need a D line filled with all pros.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

You don't need two Reggie Whites you just need a D line filled with all pros.

 

That depends on the defense. If you are running a 3-4 it is almost moot. If you are running a 4-3 the advantage still goes to the line with sheer numbers and intent of the play.

 

If I have 5 all pros on the line I will take that everyday versus 3 all pro dlineman, and still with 4 with the understanding that things have gotten tougher but the confidence is still there.

 

Now if you were running a 5 man front than yes double teaming someone would be devastating.

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

Great defense will almost always come out on top over a great offense. There's a reason why "defense wins championships" is a cliche.

 

The Raiders of the 70's had three of the best OL ever on their line and yet they could never get through the Steelers save for the 1976 season when the Steelers lost Franco and Bleier both in the week prior and their offense went to shit and could do nothing to help their defense.

 

How is it that their amazing OL didn't shit all over the Steelers each meeting, when the Steelers had only Mean Joe Greene on their DL and three other good, but not HoF caliber DL? They had great players elsewhere, an amazing front seven as a whole, scheme, et cetera.

 

How is it that Tom Brady, Randy Moss, and the greatest offense ever could only put up 14 points against only one HoF player on the entire defense (Strahan)?

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Great defense will almost always come out on top over a great offense. There's a reason why "defense wins championships" is a cliche.

 

The Raiders of the 70's had three of the best OL ever on their line and yet they could never get through the Steelers save for the 1976 season when the Steelers lost Franco and Bleier both in the week prior and their offense went to shit and could do nothing to help their defense.

 

How is it that their amazing OL didn't shit all over the Steelers each meeting, when the Steelers had only Mean Joe Greene on their DL and three other good, but not HoF caliber DL? They had great players elsewhere, an amazing front seven as a whole, scheme, et cetera.

 

How is it that Tom Brady, Randy Moss, and the greatest offense ever could only put up 14 points against only one HoF player on the entire defense (Strahan)?

 

I think the defense wins championships thing is a myth. AS much as I would like to believe that there is no empirical evidence really proving that claim.

 

Interesting Graph

 

Awesome Link

 

^^^ That link does a fantastic job of explaining my point without me having to post a forever post. It is actually one of the best write ups on the actual defense to offense comparison.

 

There are many more, but the first is just a good visual for those who dont care to read. The second goes really in depth and explains it.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I have had about enough of your shit bay. That Willie Wood pick rips it, you are going down amigo.

[Bay 2,003]