Would you draft Winston?

[butta54 371]

I know their is another thread on QBs for the draft, but I want to focus on Jameis.

 

The question is very simple. If you were the GM of a team that needed a QB would you spend a draft pick on Jameis in the first two rounds? Why or why not?

 

For me I'm going to go with no. The league has undergone a Politically Correct witch-hunt in which everyone with access to social media wants to put a close eye on the league and scrutinize what the players do. With that being said you don't have room for players that already come with baggage and polarizing names. Also players that you already know has the tendency to make stupid decisions over and over again. The round doesn't really matter for me because if you take Jameis at any point in the draft it will be a matter of time until the fanbase beats you down to play him. If I need a QB and I mean truly need than I will get mine in the first round unless the talent is really bad. And if I'm spending that high of a pick on a QB better believe it won't be Jameis.

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

I'd take him #1 if I needed a QB. Far too talented, to go anywhere else.

[Vin+ 3,121]

Yep.

[butta54 371]

Winston isn't half as good as he was last year.

[Vin+ 3,121]

Same could be said for the entire team. Tons of roster turnover will do that.

[SteVo+ 3,702]

If the Eagles are picking in the 15-25 range (as I think they will), and Foles hasn't shown improvement? Hell yes.

[butta54 371]

One of the worst red flags on-the-field is a player who regresses in college. Especially Jameis who is only in his second year as a starter.

[BC 331]

Never. Same thing I said regarding Manziel, despite the playmaking ability, I don't want to risk having big personality flaws at the QB position. I want a solid leader, squeaky clean background, and a personality that everyone looks up to. It's the only position where I'm picky about those things.

Edited October 17, 2014 by BC

[seanbrock 1,684]

Even if you get him him with incredible value on the cheap in the late rounds and he turns out to be a stud, do you really want this fucking moron to be your team leader? Do you really want to have to worry not only about the health of your scrambling franchise QB, but whether or not he's going to jail or facing personal conduct policy suspensions? Arguably the most important trait or at least of the most important traits you need from your starting QB is availability. He has to be on the field to make a difference and at this point I just couldn't pull the trigger on the guy. Maybe he'll grow up. People change and he's just a kid, but let somebody else roll the dice on that one.

 

 

Btw, I'm shocked Stevo said he would draft Winston. Very A-typical Steven thing to do especially considering how much he can't stand DeSean Jackson lol.

Edited October 17, 2014 by seanbrock

[BJORN 679]

One thing about Jameis that I love is that you really don't see many people with his natural leadership abilities. And that played a huge part in FSU's success last year and so far this year. Being able to motivate and inspire teammates can go a long way in any sport/team situation. Put his leadership qualities together with his NFL caliber size and arm...... I think its a slam dunk. No doubt I take him.

 

I think the majority of his off the field issues have been blown way out of proportion. Of course, these rape allegations definitely give me pause but that should be finally cleared up before the draft hopefully.

[FartWaffles 1,857]

If you are a team with a glaring need for a quarterback, there is no doubt you draft Jameis if he's available. With the new CBA, drafting a QB in the first round is no longer a 4-5 year commitment due to the rookie wage scale.

 

He is worth the gamble. If he shows that he can't grow up once he gets to the pros, he can ride the pine for a year or two and then get the boot.

 

You need a quarterback to win. If a team passes on him with the glaring need and don't upgrade the position elsewhere, the head coach and GM should address the fans stating that this is going to be another off year.

[seanbrock 1,684]

If you are a team with a glaring need for a quarterback, there is no doubt you draft Jameis if he's available. With the new CBA, drafting a QB in the first round is no longer a 4-5 year commitment due to the rookie wage scale.

 

He is worth the gamble. If he shows that he can't grow up once he gets to the pros, he can ride the pine for a year or two and then get the boot.

 

You need a quarterback to win. If a team passes on him with the glaring need and don't upgrade the position elsewhere, the head coach and GM should address the fans stating that this is going to be another off year.

Ok, so say you can take either Winston and all his baggage and yeah, with the new CBA you're not locked into a 4-5 year commitment but you've got the the third pick and you have a shot at the best pass rusher in the draft and lets assume for arguments sake he's elite but without the baggage of Winston. Do you risk missing out on a difference maker on defense? First round picks can be worth a lot more than just the money and commitment you'd have made drafting a QB in years past, especially when you're talking about a top 5 pick. Teams like the Raiders can't afford and others absolutely can't afford to burn high draft picks.

[butta54 371]

-First unless I'm missing something the rookie contracts are standard four years. NFL contracts aren't guarenteed so tech you aren't married to anyone, but if you draft a first or second round pick most likely you aren't going to release them because of their value and the signing bonus would be dead money.

 

-Second when a player shows they aren't ready and ride the pine (Gabbert, Locker, Ponder, Leinart, Young...etc) people get fired. To me that is NOT worth the gamble because the GM and HC are gambling and they usually lose when they miss on a first round QB.

 

-Lastly just because you need a QB doesn't mean you risk it on someone who seems to have the most natural talent. Talent is more than physical....Winston doesn't read coverages better than the average QB and he doesn't command an offense like a pro QB. He may have a big arm and athleticism, but there is a long list of those QBs. Not to mention even if he was a star on the field for your team his off-the-field issues could have him out of the game. My point from the beginning is that he doesn't make great decisions and you need that in your franchise player.

[KempBolt 498]

Nope… would not if I could somehow confirm what's said about him. I don't want that sort of person being the leader of my team's locker room and huddle.

[Attyla the Hawk 197]

Assuming there was need:

 

Yeah I take him. Although I'd insist on adding additional talent as well. I'm also not taking him in R1.

 

He has abundant talent. But I'd put him in a position to learn and earn his way onto the job. Not unlike how Cleveland is doing it with Manziel. I think they are handling the QB position there perfectly. And that's a credit to the organization and coaching staff there.

 

When you have dire need, you have to either be bad enough to get a more sure thing, or you have to get a warty prospect and hope he develops as a player and leader. I wouldn't put myself in a position to make Winston the face of my franchise at this point. But I wouldn't hesitate to take him with significant draft stock and work with him for a couple seasons.

[KempBolt 498]

If he really raped a girl, it's disgusting that someone would want him on their team. After all the outrage here and elsewhere about the light treatment (originally) of Ray Rice, I don't understand why this wouldn't bother people even more.

[RazorStar 4,025]

Not even in the 7th round. Personality busts are a no fly zone for any seriously competitive team.

[oochymp 2,393]

depends on how the interviews go, but from what I know (which is far less than any NFL scout) I would definitely take him in the first two rounds, not sure I'd take him in the top ten, depends on who else is available, but I'm not going to avoid the guy

 

I haven't read nearly everything written about him nor do I think everything written even gives a full picture, but from where I sit he seems to have a tendency toward Ben Roethlisberger-esque bafoonery, and that hasn't done anything to slow Big Ben down as far as on field performance, I haven't seen enough to make me to labe a guy with as much talent as Jameis has as undraftable

Edited October 17, 2014 by oochymp

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

Winston's on the field IQ is higher, but his off the field IQ is right on par with Vince Young. I'd stay far, FAR away from him myself.

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

Ok, so say you can take either Winston and all his baggage and yeah, with the new CBA you're not locked into a 4-5 year commitment but you've got the the third pick and you have a shot at the best pass rusher in the draft and lets assume for arguments sake he's elite but without the baggage of Winston. Do you risk missing out on a difference maker on defense? First round picks can be worth a lot more than just the money and commitment you'd have made drafting a QB in years past, especially when you're talking about a top 5 pick. Teams like the Raiders can't afford and others absolutely can't afford to burn high draft picks.

 

Would you rather risk miss out on a elite QB? Or an elite defensive end?

Edited October 17, 2014 by DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F

[RazorStar 4,025]

At the same time, when you take a QB highly, you're hitching your job security to him. Do you risk your job on an off the field dumbass, or save your chances on a QB next year who isn't a massive red flag, and improve the team in the mean time.

[butta54 371]

I also want to throw this out there. For all the people advocating to gamble on Winston based on talent....I'm not sure he is the top 5 draft prospect that everyone in the media is buzzing about.

 

So many times with a QB people look height-weight-speed-big arm and you know what that is a dangerous evaluation. Winston isn't the student of the game that a Luck, Wilson, Ryan, Rivers, Rodgers, or even Alex Smith was. The mental ability isn't off the charts and add in the fact he is dumb off the field really makes you question the player. I don't smell anything near elite with him.

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

depends on how the interviews go, but from what I know (which is far less than any NFL scout) I would definitely take him in the first two rounds, not sure I'd take him in the top ten, depends on who else is available, but I'm not going to avoid the guy

 

I haven't read nearly everything written about him nor do I think everything written even gives a full picture, but from where I sit he seems to have a tendency toward Ben Roethlisberger-esque bafoonery, and that hasn't done anything to slow Big Ben down as far as on field performance, I haven't seen enough to make me to labe a guy with as much talent as Jameis has as undraftable

Ben is in no way comparable to Winston other than the fact that they were both accused of rape. Ben had no problems through college and is articulate. Winston is half retarded and has had numerous problems just in college, where he was actually at fault.

 

-Ben was hit by a car when a woman failed to yield. He was riding without a helmet in a state where the law permits him to do so. I'm sure every NFL player wears his seat belt, yeah?

 

-He was accused of rape by a woman that was nuts and had previously been telling people that she was engaged to and carrying the child of a married Marine (or something, he was in the military) and later on was bragging to the same co-workers that she was carrying a "little Roethlisberger". Charges were only filed in a civil court a year after he was at the golf tournament and also named her co-workers and employer. The suit was dismissed in a settlement.

 

-Roethlisberger was accused of rape a second time, but the DA chose not to press charges due to lack of evidence and the girl also requested for the charges to be dropped. The girl was 20 and had been bar hopping with her sorority, all of whom were wearing pins stating, "down to fuck". She initially stated he did not rape her and her stories were inconsistent and everyone agreed that both parties were intoxicated.

 

 

 

-Winston has been accused of rape, but not charged. We don't know much about the situation, except that semen was found, she was bruised, but her blood was clear of drugs, and Winston was never even interviewed. Winston's roommate admitted to having taped part of what happened, but stated it was not rape. Winston's DNA was taken much later and was a match for the semen on her underwear. The alleged victim and her parents claim that the investigator tried convincing her to drop the charges because "it's a football town". He has worked with the Seminole Boosters, a group that provides a lot of funding to FSU.

 

The investigation has been marred by shoddy police work and FSU failed to conduct their paltry investigation until after he had played the entire 2013 season, so most evidence was lost.

 

-He has multiple instances where he caused trouble with a fucking BB gun. He and other players broke windows at his apartment while having a BB gun fight and he also brought one onto campus to shoot squirrels.

 

-Winston antagonized a Burger King worker by walking in and repeatedly drinking soda from the fountain out of ketchup cups after she declined to give him a water cup to steal it.

 

-He stole crab legs from a store...

 

-He stood on a table on campus and repeatedly yelled "fuck her right in the pussy" and was suspended a game for it.

 

-Now he's being accused of selling autographs.

 

 

What a shitty, shortsighted comparison.

 

 

I don't claim to know that he raped the girl, it could've happened as he and his roommate say. However, his semen was found on her clothing, she was bruised, and another girl that had had sex with Jameis ("she did not say 'no'") saw a counselor afterward because of the encounter. There's mountains more here against Jameis than there ever was against Ben.

 

Ben was guilty of being a fratboy douchebag, but if you knew anything about either accusation, you know he didn't rape anyone. In Winston's case, there is or was actual evidence against him.

 

 

 

I would not draft him. Even ignoring the rape allegation, he's proven to be inexplicably moronic.

Edited October 17, 2014 by Zack_of_Steel

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

I also want to throw this out there. For all the people advocating to gamble on Winston based on talent....I'm not sure he is the top 5 draft prospect that everyone in the media is buzzing about.

 

So many times with a QB people look height-weight-speed-big arm and you know what that is a dangerous evaluation. Winston isn't the student of the game that a Luck, Wilson, Ryan, Rivers, Rodgers, or even Alex Smith was. The mental ability isn't off the charts and add in the fact he is dumb off the field really makes you question the player. I don't smell anything near elite with him.

 

Are we talking about the same QB who learned a Jimbo Fisher playbook as a 18 year old redshirt freshmen and went on to have a great season?

[butta54 371]

 

Are we talking about the same QB who learned a Jimbo Fisher playbook as a 18 year old redshirt freshmen and went on to have a great season?

 

Redshirt Freshmen who committed there before the All-American game and was learning the playbook every since. Had his whole redshirt year to learn it. Then he finally played.

 

Plus we are talking about the same offense that EJ MANUEL had to learn.