SteVo+ 3,702 Posted September 12, 2015 Let's hear it, TGP. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theMileHighGuy 656 Posted September 12, 2015 Damn this is a sparse field, yo Bernie ftw though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge+ 3,436 Posted September 12, 2015 Bernie... who else? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Phailadelphia Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) I'll probably be crucified by TGP for this but of those 3 options...probably Biden. On that note, people constantly complain of all the crooked, shitty people we elect as POTUS and how they want a legitimately good person in the White House. Well...Biden is that dude. I like some things about Bernie Sanders but if elected he'd be REALLY bad for my career. Here's to hoping another Barack Obama emerges from the field a la 2008. Edited September 13, 2015 by Phailadelphia Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted September 13, 2015 The only vote Hillary is getting in this poll is a troll vote lol. Hillary sucks so bad. I voted Bernie btw. It seems like he's the only person running that cares about the people. Biden seems like a fucking moron. It'd be like George W. Bush all over again. He'd make us look so bad on the national stage. He says a lot of stupid shit. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge+ 3,436 Posted September 13, 2015 Here's to hoping another Barack Obama emerges from the field a la 2008. Bernie is Barack... just not black and more socialist. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted September 13, 2015 Bernie is Barack... just not black and more socialist. Barrack Obama has been a fucking corporatist war criminal. I hope Bernie Sanders is nothing like Obama. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Favre4Ever+ 4,476 Posted September 13, 2015 I think Phail was talking more... Kind of a candidate that you didn't see coming. Someone who will surprise you in a good kind of way.Anyway, shout out to my old butt buddies. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Phailadelphia Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) Yup, what F4E said. Bernie is Barack... just not black and more socialist. Bernie is more like a not racist Ron Paul. Edited September 13, 2015 by Phailadelphia 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge+ 3,436 Posted September 13, 2015 I think Phail was talking more... Kind of a candidate that you didn't see coming. Someone who will surprise you in a good kind of way. That's what i thought too. Bernie fits the bill. And fair point, Phail. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted September 13, 2015 Most politicians are like hookers, bought and paid for, but you have to pay way more to get anal. Bernie Sanders has run 0% of his campaign off corporate dollars. How can you not support this guy? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BwareDWare94 723 Posted September 13, 2015 I don't know if Bernie can actually change enough of the corrupt bullshit in our country over a 4-8 year period, but as he's determined to actually make the immensely wealthy pay taxes, pay their employees and give them livable benefits, my vote goes to him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Phailadelphia Posted September 13, 2015 Most politicians are like hookers, bought and paid for, but you have to pay way more to get anal. Bernie Sanders has run 0% of his campaign off corporate dollars. How can you not support this guy? Because this... \/ I like some things about Bernie Sanders but if elected he'd be REALLY bad for my career. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cherry 1,302 Posted September 14, 2015 Sorry, Bernie would kill the economy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge+ 3,436 Posted September 14, 2015 Kill the economy how? By creating tens of millions of new jobs? By helping immigrants become legal citizens thereby having their income on the books for tax purposes? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theMileHighGuy 656 Posted September 14, 2015 Yeah. You can't say Bernie is going to kill the economy and not say why. Yes, his plans are gonna be painful to certain careers and tax brackets, but overall the economy should succeed. That's the point. Everyone survives. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BwareDWare94 723 Posted September 14, 2015 The economy has been killed by the countless employers who don't provide enough benefits and enough in wages or salary to allow their employees to put much money back into it as opposed to draining their accounts on bills and then squelching by on next to nothing. The economy has been killed by the immensely wealthy evading taxes and hoarding money and not re-investing in our country's financial infrastructure. The economy has been killed by too many people and not enough jobs available. Bernie's going to address these issues. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cherry 1,302 Posted September 14, 2015 (edited) If the minimum wage rises to $15 an hour, businesses are just going to raise the price of their products, which does absolutely nothing to help the standard of living. It will, however, cause employers to cut hours and employees to keep from initially going under until prices naturally rise again. Instead of working for 20 hours a week at $10/hr, they'll work 13ish hours for $15/hr. We've seen what happens already when the government forces companies to alter what they pay employees. Force them to pay medical care for any employee who works 40 hours a week? Everyone just had hour cuts. Some people were laid off. Unless Bernie can bring back American businesses and stop the outsourcing, he will hurt the economy. Unless Bernie can bring China up to the same level as us, he will hurt the economy. Bernie wants to spend spend spend, but he's not clarifying where exactly the money is coming from. Don't get me wrong, I love me some Bernie. He has the perfect message. The only problem is he won't actually be able to accomplish what he wants. Edited September 14, 2015 by Chernobyl426 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted September 14, 2015 To my knowledge Bernie Sanders is the only presidential candidate who wants to end "free trade" agreements which over the last 60 years have sent millions of American jobs overseas so that right there will bring back jobs. He also wants to invest in national infrastructure instead of going to war every 8-10 years. If the richest people in the country pay their fair share in taxes and people make a livable wage, they'll buy more shit and companies won't HAVE to raise prices because they'll make more money. If more people could afford to go on vacations, go out to eat, etc then the economy booms. That's why when you look at the numbers (TIME magazine recently put out a chart) the economy is at it's best when the minimum wage is at it's highest adjusted to inflation of course. It's a really basic law of economy. Demand supplies the economy. If people are broke they're not spending as much money or you could say the demand is significantly less. If I have 10 Billion dollars I really only ever am going to spend of a fraction of that, but if I make 40-50k a year I'm spending almost every penny of that and MAYBE saving a couple thousand a year. Not only are millionaires and billionaires saving their money and not circulating it through the economy but they stash it over seas so they don't have to pay the taxes on it that we all do even though we make far less money. Simply put, you're wrong. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge+ 3,436 Posted September 14, 2015 Probably one of the best posts I've ever seen. sean. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cherry 1,302 Posted September 14, 2015 Yes, but what are the odds he'll manage to end those agreements in a congress that would aggressively oppose him? The outrage over that would make the Iran deal anger look like a couple kids throwing a tantrum. IF Bernie can succeed, then sure. What are the legitimate odds that he can beat a political machine stacked against him? Everything else I agree with. Basic economics that those who have less spend a higher % of what they earn. I'd just try to find a different way of rebalancing distribution of wealth. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted September 14, 2015 (edited) The odds that he'll manage to end those agreements are about the same as the odds of him getting elected, so if he gets into office why would you stop having faith in him then? Just because he might not succeed in producing the change that he's talking about, change that NEEDS to happen, is literally the dumbest possible reason not to vote for Sanders if you actually agree with him or think his ideas could/would work. Reversing policies that have been put in place over the course of centuries in some cases might not happen in 4 or 8 years, but fuck you have to start somewhere. What's the alternative? Sometimes meeting these people in the middle of what's already so far off the map it's ridiculous is just unacceptable and distorts people's reality of what is and what isn't. It's kind of like DEBATING whether evolution exists. There is no alternative point of view. Sometimes there's no room for opinion. Sometimes it's just black and white, right and wrong. Edited September 14, 2015 by seanbrock Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sarge+ 3,436 Posted September 15, 2015 Bernie is up 10 points in Iowa. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oochymp 2,393 Posted September 15, 2015 Price Tag of Bernie Sanders’s Proposals: $18 Trillion - WSJ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted September 15, 2015 (edited) I Wonder how much of that cost will be covered by 1. military spending cuts and 2. billionaires/millionaires and multinational corporations actually paying their fair share of taxes. I Wonder how much of that will be off set by bringing back jobs from Latin America, China and South East Asia. Our GDP last year was 16.77 Trillion in one year. We're the worlds largest economy. Git 'er done. Edited September 15, 2015 by seanbrock Share this post Link to post Share on other sites