Trump Regime thread.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Omerta I was out of line calling you a far-right idiot. I apologize. I just get so emotional over this issue because it hits home for me (being a high school teacher in the same district as Stoneman Douglas) and I get so frustrated at everyone approaching this issue from one of two extremes: that absolutely nothing can be done about gun violence, and that one gun control bill will magically solve everything.

 

It's all good man. I don't blame you for being emotional about, considering how close you are too it. I agree with you on the one of two extremes, which is why reasoned discourse is so important. Which brings me to why David Hogg bothers my (admittedly there is a myriad of reasons) He is adding chaff to the wheat and getting people emotional when he his entire story's validity is up for debate. What I am afraid of is that he will be the face, and then it is going to come out he is a liar, and it will undermine the credibility of what the other people went through.

 

There is no easy solution, and we should look for them, but I am not sure more legislation is the answer. I think we could go along way enforcing the laws we already have on the books.

[BwareDWare94 723]

David Hogg needs to accept invitations to debate or he will never reach a large audience. His interviews are utterly annoying....because he's a kid. It's not even his fault.

 

This idea that we need to comply with the wants of all these high school students is absurd. Parkland and their clear backpack policy might be the smartest measure against potential shootings that doesn't involve arming schools or disarming everybody. And the kids and leftist media hate it lol

[Thanatos 2,847]

Lmao @ Linking to a conspiracy theorist's video, (look at the comments, lol. "Help me find this kid," "shootings were orchestrated" "kid is into something far more evil than him") and arguing that someone rehearsing what they want to say before going on TV is somehow a shady thing to do.

 

Strawman after strawman in this thread. Prop up the argument as something else entirely to make it seem ridiculous.

 

We aren't saying "these are kids so we have to listen to everything they say." Or rather, do whatever they say. I get pissed off by shit like what Ngata keeps posting about them being given cue cards. I mean I'm sure he's reading a teleprompter- news media does that too, because you don't want to stumble over your words. I have a rather annoying stuttering problem when I am nervous, were I ever in a similar situation I would write down what I wanted to say too, as its easier for me to read it than to say it. Your implication is that the words are not his, but were written for him and are not what he actually wants to say, but what the leftist organizations behind him want him to say.

 

You are 100% allowed to disagree with the teenagers here, because they're obviously just teenagers. Just be respectful and understanding of kids who have seen other kids die in front of them. There's no reason to slander them.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Thanatos

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

David Hogg is a disgusting human being. He's standing on the graves of his classmates to gain fame and notoriety. I call politicians out for doing it-- I don't mind calling out teens who are part of the media for doing it as well. Nobody is above criticism. Nobody. Saying or acting like they are above criticism because they survived a shooting is laughable.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

David Hogg is a disgusting human being. He's standing on the graves of his classmates to gain fame and notoriety. I call politicians out for doing it-- I don't mind calling out teens who are part of the media for doing it as well. Nobody is above criticism. Nobody. Saying or acting like they are above criticism because they survived a shooting is laughable.

 

Can't say that you meanie.

[seanbrock 1,684]

I thought we decided the shit this kid was saying was inconsequential... To those of you guys shitting on him, do you really think him or his classmates have moved anyone on this issue? The only thing you accomplish by arguing about him is guarantee his 15 minutes of fame lasts a little longer. He probably loves people going after him for being denied by colleges. Keep talking about him and not changing the channel when he's on TV and you're gonna make sure the kid actually makes money off this.

 

JD posted Trump wants to get out of Syria. I think that's a lot more significant than gun control.

[Thanatos 2,847]

David Hogg is a disgusting human being. He's standing on the graves of his classmates to gain fame and notoriety. I call politicians out for doing it-- I don't mind calling out teens who are part of the media for doing it as well. Nobody is above criticism. Nobody. Saying or acting like they are above criticism because they survived a shooting is laughable.

 

Another strawman. No one is saying you can't critique him. It's the insults and the far right conspiracy theories like what Ngata is posting that are ridiculous.

 

The idea that there are people on this board who think calling a 17 year old fucking kid a disgusting human being after seeing what he saw is what is truly disgusting. I'm sure yall were perfect 17 year olds, and none of you had to live through what he did.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

 

Another strawman. No one is saying you can't critique him. It's the insults and the far right conspiracy theories like what Ngata is posting that are ridiculous.

 

The idea that there are people on this board who think calling a 17 year old fucking kid a disgusting human being after seeing what he saw is what is truly disgusting. I'm sure yall were perfect 17 year olds, and none of you had to live through what he did.

 

I watched people commit suicide by willfully jumping out of windows more than 1k feet above the ground. How dare you call me disgusting after what I witnessed.

[seanbrock 1,684]

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

 

Can't you guys feel the puppet strings tugging at you? Who the fuck cares about this kid? Who the fuck cares what people say about him? Realize we had one of the most popular shows on TV for a few years that was making fun of a fat little girl (honey boo boo). This is how people act in the realm of politics, tribalism, hurling insults at one another, straw manning each other. To what ends? lol I don't get it.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

People who think they are better because they play the moral card are dangerous. It takes an entitled prick to constantly berate others not because of policy or anything substantive... but over their false moral high ground.

 

To varying degrees... Everyone has seen some shit. Everyone has problems.

 

And you're totally right about the tribalism of politics, etc etc. I try staying out of some of it, but holy shit... When you have Thanatos up on a hilltop, crowning himself moral compass of the world and telling us how we SHOULD feel and how we SHOULD act over and over... Spewing out of his mouth like a fat womans toes out of Sean's mouth... You just can only take so much.

 

This isn't an insult, or not.. meant as one anyway.. But I think it's telling that the two people that have done this the most are members like Blots and Thanatos who are born into some serious privilege. Not to say that they don't have their shit to deal with too, as I mentioned about everyone has their own shit to deal with. But I think it skews the perspective monumentally.

 

People who have really dealt with a shit hand in life or who have gone through shit to raise themselves up above it (like Ngata) see the world differently than other individuals. People who have been through, relatively more real shit aren't going to cry for David Hogg.

Look.. Being huddled in a classroom while there is a gunman in your school killing classmates would suck, even be tormenting. I empathize. However, it's not a reason to put him on a pedestal or act like he is anything more.

 

The problem with tribalism in politics is that it completely subdues reason. It takes it and logic and pretty much throws it in the trash as it pulls at people on both sides emotionally. Our views are shaped by the groups (tribes) that we most identify. It's at the core of our existence. Throughout history our species and every other on the planet have relied on their tribes for survival. And even though we are, to a degree, beyond that... It's hard and sometimes nearly impossible to toss that instinct aside.

Edited March 31, 2018 by Olenna4Ever

[Omerta+ 1,206]

:facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm: :facepalm:

 

Can't you guys feel the puppet strings tugging at you? Who the fuck cares about this kid? Who the fuck cares what people say about him? Realize we had one of the most popular shows on TV for a few years that was making fun of a fat little girl (honey boo boo). This is how people act in the realm of politics, tribalism, hurling insults at one another, straw manning each other. To what ends? lol I don't get it.

 

Bro, I don't even know what you're talking about lol. I have insulted nobody here. Stevo is still my dude, and me and JD agree and I agree with Bear. I. Not sure what you are talking about lol. I haven't seen anything that you are talking about lol.

[seanbrock 1,684]

I have to be honest. I really like the way that Trump has started to go after Amazon and Bezos.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

People who think they are better because they play the moral card are dangerous. It takes an entitled prick to constantly berate others not because of policy or anything substantive... but over their false moral high ground.

 

To varying degrees... Everyone has seen some shit. Everyone has problems.

 

And you're totally right about the tribalism of politics, etc etc. I try staying out of some of it, but holy shit... When you have Thanatos up on a hilltop, crowning himself moral compass of the world and telling us how we SHOULD feel and how we SHOULD act over and over... Spewing out of his mouth like a fat womans toes out of Sean's mouth... You just can only take so much.

 

This isn't an insult, or not.. meant as one anyway.. But I think it's telling that the two people that have done this the most are members like Blots and Thanatos who are born into some serious privilege. Not to say that they don't have their shit to deal with too, as I mentioned about everyone has their own shit to deal with. But I think it skews the perspective monumentally.

 

People who have really dealt with a shit hand in life or who have gone through shit to raise themselves up above it (like Ngata) see the world differently than other individuals. People who have been through, relatively more real shit aren't going to cry for David Hogg.

 

Look.. Being huddled in a classroom while there is a gunman in your school killing classmates would suck, even be tormenting. I empathize. However, it's not a reason to put him on a pedestal or act like he is anything more.

 

 

That truly is up for debate. He has given several contradicting stories since it happened and nobody can really verify the authenticity of anything he says. It is left up to you to believe him or not.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I have to be honest. I really like the way that Trump has started to go after Amazon and Bezos.

 

I am not gonna say I hate it.. but this is some funky waters we're wading into. If he isn't stopped though, Bezos is going to practically run every market of every product in the country though.

 

 

That truly is up for debate. He has given several contradicting stories since it happened and nobody can really verify the authenticity of anything he says. It is left up to you to believe him or not.

 

Here's the thing.. I am not as educated as most are on this specifically. I've read a few things... saw him talk a couple of times.. in MY opinion.. he came across insincere and douchey so I just really avoided almost everything Hogg up until this thread pulled me in kicking and screaming.

 

I read your post earlier, but.. Just reading Stevo and Than's posts makes me believe he was like in actual shooter range and literally watched his classmates die directly in front of him. Is that not the case?

 

 

Separately.... Relating back to Trump wanting to get the fuck out of Syria. The United States has decided to freeze more than $200M that was supposed to go to Syrian recovery.

 

If Trump can get us out of Syria and a few other places.. that alone might signal the most positive presidency in a long time. Since Reagan at best (relative to time, it may go back further than that though).

 

[Thanatos 2,847]

It is apparently controversial on this board to say that you shouldn't call a kid disgusting who survived what he did.

 

Favre, if you were trying to do something to prevent suicide after seeing what you saw, and then people attacked you and called you a disgusting human being and that you should just stay quiet and stop parroting what you were being told, then you would be absolutely right. My point is that someone who sees a tragedy and then tries to stop that tragedy from happening again is obviously going to be emotional, so you should probably demonstrate some empathy when talking to/about them. It does not mean they are right, it merely means I am sick of seeing people not be treated like they are also human beings just because you (generally speaking, not directed at you, more so the people in this country as a whole), disagree with their political views.

 

For example, there is this huge rush on the right to demonize these kids because they are pushing for more gun control, and they attack them from the extreme position. It's not enough for them to say the kids are wrong, they have to come up with crazy conspiracy theories about the leftist media feeding them lines, or that they're being paid to be "crisis actors" as per Alex Jones and InfoWars, etc. etc. They can't empathize with them and say they disagree and yet be respectful about it. I may 100% disagree with Marco Rubio and his position on this thing, but the way he handled that town hall was very respectful. I think he dodged a few questions, to be sure, but he never let his emotions get the best of him. You continue to put words in my mouth and act like I am claiming you can't disagree with them at all, that is absolutely not what I'm saying and I have said this ad nauseum in this thread.

 

As far as privilege goes, I ain't claiming I'm some oppressed person or anything, but privilege? I've worked a shit job for the past three years for $10/hr doing manager work. During the last six months I had enough of that and worked my tail off to do my job and get some better qualifications, and recently I applied for and got a much better job that has a large guaranteed pay raise after I pass another test. It is also a job I can make a career out of. So please don't pretend like you know anything about me, because you don't.

 

That is honestly the last thing I am going to say on these forums, because there is no point anymore. Yall have fun. Ciao.

[seanbrock 1,684]

Bezos is a real dangerous dude. He's involved in media now too and he has a CIA contract. It's pretty obvious that it's a problem that he's driving so many out of business and he's doing this all while there are a lot of complaints about working conditions.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

The diversity he has is really scary, especially if he can get them to scale at even a fraction of what Amazon has. As you mentioned, having a guy like him who has altered retail so drastically also own one of the largest papers is kind of scary.

 

Amazon, Twitch, Whole Foods, Zappos, The Washington Post... he has or had money in Twitter, Google, Business Insider. Trump hasn't backed off yet, either.. He just keeps ramping up the attacks. Not sure if it was actually translate into anything substantial though.

[seanbrock 1,684]

If I was Trump I would seize Amazon and break it into a million pieces. We have anti-trust laws on the books for a reason. This doesn't end well lol. I wouldn't want to stop the guy from investing his money how he wants but he can't be allowed to do what he's doing right now.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

The problem is... as I see it... That we have let it go on for so long. This is really an unprecedented run by Amazon and Bezos. All along the way, they have bullied small distributors and publishers in every genre / market you can think of. With the risk of being called some crazy conspiracy guy -- it's people like Bezos who run the world. And even though they are extremely diverse and control a lot of different markets.. can it be argued that they have a monopoly in any of them?

Idk man.. I think it's gonna be tough.

[seanbrock 1,684]

Trump is going about it EXACTLY the right way though. He's using his position and using the fact that he can get on TV and talk to hundreds of millions of people. That's what FDR did. That's what Teddy did. There's a lot about Trump that I hate but he's one of few people who understands or maybe is just willing to take people on like that. It won't be easy but it has been done before.

[BJORN 679]

 

This is him either rehearsing or reading cue cards and being given affirmation by someone behind the camera.

 

 

According to him, he did and did not watch people die. I dont know how you do both, but the little fuckwad even says he wanted video lol. He is a fame-seeking cunt.

It is pretty standard to practice and rehearse before public speaking. Pretty ludicrous to develop a conspiracy theory around that. I don't care for his message but I am just saying...

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I'm not saying he is an actor. I am not saying there is a conspiracy. Here is what I think. I don't think he was there personally. I think when he said he was on his bike he was telling the truth, but knew the message would be less powerful, so he fabricates a story he know the veracity can't be proven. And here we are.

[Vin+ 3,121]

All of the main faces of this movement are fairly obnoxious, tbh. It's possible that their tweets just make it seem that way, but I'm not sure.

 

Kinda sucks given what happened, but it is what it is I guess.

 

[Thanatos 2,847]

Alright, I will say one more thing before I stop coming over here to the politics section. (Which was all I meant by that, I'll still hang around football and shit, just think I get too heated over here and I really don't think there's a point to talking about it.) I want people to understand why I get pissed at people promoting these extreme conspiracy theories like Ngata is doing in this thread. It's real easy to slander this guy, it's real hard to walk it back.

 

I already explained why the first video is bullshit, BJORN echoed it.

 

The second video is a misleading cut of a whole interview to make it seem like Hogg is lying. The original article is here: https://www.redstate.com/sarah-rumpf/2018/03/26/new-video-casts-doubt-whether-david-hogg-school-day-shooting/

 

From Red State, a far right blog. To their credit, the author corrected the error, which is why its in strikethrough.

 

Here is what happened, according to the whole interview.

 

The day of the shooting Hogg was at school. The shooting happens, the kids are escorted out. There are multiple witnesses that say Hogg was there, this isn't just his word. He then leaves the school at in the early afternoon. Later on, he concludes that it is best for him to return to the school, (not inside it, obviously, but where the people are standing on the sidewalks outside the school), with a camera to do some interviews. The kid is a student journalist after all. I don't think I would have done what he did, just because I don't think I'd be able to, but props to him for doing so.

 

There is absolutely no contradiction at all. He lays out this timeline in the interview, the entire thing. He does not contradict himself in the slightest. But this one dude on the internet recuts the interview, leaving out the critical middle part where he says he returns home, and people who don't like this kid's views retweet it, post it everywhere, and some people spread it, and then some other people think there's some sort of question involved and maybe Hogg is just a dirty liar, and so we can slander the kid.

 

You can't use these guys as sources, because of this. They constantly do this shit, over and over again. And then it gets put out there and the far right, (in this case, because the kid has views against them, the far left does the same thing when the situation is reversed), posts that shit everywhere and now it might as well be a fact.

 

The person that runs the channel which that video is on is arguing in the youtube comments section that it is David Hogg who is responsible for the SHOOTING.

 

You cannot trust people like this. You cannot give them the time of day, you certainly cannot use them as a source. That's the truth.

Edited April 1, 2018 by Thanatos

[seanbrock 1,684]

lol

 

You guys see the Pope came out against the violence in Syria? I'm not religious at all but I fucking love this Pope. Really hope Trump sticks to his guns on this and gets us out of Syria.