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seanbrock

You're president, what do you do?

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I think that was a little bit of hyperbole man, relax lol

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I think that was a little bit of hyperbole man, relax lol

So he really just doesn't care if poor people starve? Not sure what the hyperbole represents.

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What the fuck.

Man, you really do look for a reason to be outraged don't you? Out of everything I said, that's what you took away from it? I think you missed the message.

 

Although, I will throw you a bone. To feed your need to be outraged I will hand you this little nugget. If they are shity parents, Yeah by all means die in a fire. This goes along with what I said about Chester Bennington. Not to open Old Wounds, for apparently this entire boards Messiah, but when you leave your kids worse for where I have zero tolerance for you. Once you have a child, that is your one goal in life. So, when parents fuck it up no I give zero fucks about what happens to them. It has nothing to do with poor people, I grew up poor standing in line for government cheese with my mother. Back then privates in the Army didn't make much, and my mom had to stay home with my brothers and sisters. I have all the empathy in the world for poor people, and wish them nothing but the best, just so long as they get up every morning and try to do the best they can by themselves and their children.

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Your first post did not make that clear. I don't really feel sympathy for parents that are shitty to their kids either. It's just not always so simple as good vs bad.

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Your first post did not make that clear. I don't really feel sympathy for parents that are shitty to their kids either. It's just not always so simple as good vs bad.

It is though. Are you doing the best that can be done in your situation? That's it. That is all anyone can ask.

Edited by Omerta

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You know that children have more needs than just food right? :huh:

I also realize that their parents can choose to spend their money more wisely and provide some of their needs

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I grew up poor as dirt as did many of my friends and these issues you talk about are not really very common. To be honest I think this line of thinking for a lot of people (maybe not you) is racially motivated. Some poor people live like that, it's true but at what point do we hold creditors and banks accountable for giving people credit and mortgages and shit that they know they can't afford? I say banks and credit card companies that do that too much just are SOL and they get nothing. That might solve some of what you're talking about. Fuck predatory loaning.

 

This x1000.

 

My best friend's brother is a doctor. Right out of medical school, 150k in debt, the bank wanted to give him a million dollar loan so he could buy a house.

 

Now he was smart and he refused, and then rented an apartment for two years, by which point his debt was entirely cleared, since, ya know, doctors make a ton of money.

 

Banks giving people loans they know they cant afford and then running them into the ground has been an issue for years.

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If you ever had to live on welfare you would understand how moronic of an idea it is to think that people have more kids to get more welfare money to better their financial situation. I've seen a lot more people abuse disability than I have families on food stamps or some shit like that. Even disability though, most people I know that have that really are fucked up.

 

I think you (and probably Bware) are thinking about this specific example as too black and white. Are there people out there sitting at home telling some dude (because the women typically, but not always, end up with the children) they just met that they are hard up for cash and need to get pregnant because they are gonna get rich of the government or something? Of course not (or maybe an extreme few).

 

And it's a HUGE misconception about welfare that the only assistance comes in cash, which is capped and runs out eventually anyway. But a lot of burden is lifted with hundreds of dollars in food stamps a month (depending on how many kids you have).. You could be living in government housing.. Kids lunches are paid for at school... the state pays for her and her kids' healthcare.. There are also a lot of utility assistance programs and programs that will pay for her phone and for internet at home.

 

You aren't getting rich off having more kids. But what where is the incentive to actually go to work, when you lose a lot of those benefits when you do? There really isn't any. Welcome to the Welfare State.

 

 

A 2013 Cato Institute report on the total level of welfare benefits by state examined how much a “typical welfare family,” of a single mother with two children, would receive for what researchers determined was a typical welfare package. That included Temporary Assistance for Needy Families (TANF) cash assistance, the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP, which is still popularly known by its former name, food stamps), Medicaid, housing assistance, utility assistance and the Women, Infants and Children program (WIC). Researchers also accounted for federal and state tax deductions, exemptions and credits, such as the earned income tax credit and child tax credit.

Researchers then compared the findings to minimum-wage jobs in 35 states, before and after taxes. In 11 states, government aid paid more than the average pre-tax first year wage for a teacher, the study found.

 

 

If you enjoy analytical type pieces, that report linked above is actually very educational. .. Just as a quick example, if you live in my state of Iowa, you can get up to $20k in benefits off Welfare.. .

 

A lot of these people we are talking about are unskilled workers, who probably haven't done a ton of working anyway, so they will be lower in the wage scale. In Iowa, the minimum wage is 7.25 and a full years worth of wages PRE TAX is $14k...

 

Something isn't exactly adding up here.

 

Again.. Where is the incentive to go to work or to pursue a decent but not great paying job? What incentive is there to better yourself when the result of doing so is actually potentially doing more harm than good?

 

To make 20k a year after taxes, you'd need to get a job paying $12 an hour here... As an unskilled worker, you need to make $5 over minimum wage just to break even on the benefits you could receive from welfare... That's pretty insane.

 

I will keep repeating it.. Incentive to work comes from where...?

 

Edit:

And before someone gets offended, I am not trying to demonize these people. It's tough to get by for a lot of us. I understand, to a degree, that hardship. Sometimes you just do what you have to do to make it, and I don't inherently fault people for that. The system is broken, however (obviously).

Edited by Olenna4Ever

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The issue there isn't that welfare is too high, its that wages are too low.

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I don't necessarily disagree with that. But I also don't think just hiking minimum wage up is an end-all solution. How do you determine worth though? What should a fast food employee reasonably make? I just work in a warehouse, stocking shelves.. Takes not a lick of intelligence, completely brainless in every way... What do I really deserve as an unskilled worker?

I also think "stuff" costs too much. How do you determine the value of something. Typically by supply and demand, right. Pretty simple economics.

 

But life is a circle, as they say. You can get a pretty run of the mill, boring apartment in LA or NY for THOUSANDS a month. That's fucking bonkers. Why does a shit hole cost that much? Well, because where it's located is coveted. If people didn't want to live there, prices would go down. So why do people put themselves into a situation like that to begin with? There's a lot of factors to that of course.

So if you just jack wages up and those people who own and make the "stuff" realize that those people who are paying thousands for their shit hole apartment all of a sudden have more expendable cash.. why not raise prices on them?

It's a complex issue without a real clear solution, IMO.

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Is there actually anything anyone can do about university tuition? Seriously, we just had a tuition spike this year. I have no idea why it's happening, because I've heard from so many different sites, sources, and people that it comes from x, y, or z. OSU does an abundance of renovations and construction, and literally just finished the first or second phase of construction to force sophomores to stay on campus an extra year. Seems like the universities are just able to hike the tuition whenever they want.

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Yeah it's pretty fucked up. At this point they know most people have to go to college, they know they're getting federal money so they just charge whatever they want. If they're going to get tax dollars they should not be allowed to price gouge their students. It's going to create a MAJOR fucking economic bubble too when all these people start defaulting on their debt. The amount of private debt American's are shouldered with is going to create another depression. That's why honestly student loan forgiveness is such a good idea but if the government is paying these debts off they need to be like....yeah you're getting like 45% of this, fuck you. lol

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