Warhorse

Cherry nails the Chargers pick

4 out of 6

Razor 3 out of the first 4....props.

1. Browns- Mitchell Trubisky 2. Niners- Myles Garrett 3. Bears- Solomon Thomas 4. Jags- Jamal Adams 5.Titans- Marshon Lattimore 6. Jets- Deshaun Watson 7. Saints- John Ross 8. Panthers- Leonard Fournette 9. Bengals- Derek Barnett 10 Bills- OJ Howard 11. Chargers- Malik Hooker 12. Browns- Jon Allen 13. Cardinals- Deshone Kizer 14. Eagles- Mike Williams 15. Colts- Christian McCaffrey 16. Ravens- Reuben Foster 17. Redskins- Corey Davis 18. Titans- Haason Reddick 19. Bucs- Dalvin Cook 20. Broncos- Cam Robinson 21. Lions- David Njoku 22. Dolphins- Taco Charlton 23. Giants- Zach Cunningham 24. Raiders- Malik McDowell 25. Houston- Pat Mahomes 26. Seattle- Davis Webb 27. Chiefs- Marlon Humphrey 28. Cowboys- Takkarist McKinley 29. Ravens- Tre' White 30. Pittsburgh- Charles Harris 31. Falcons- Chidobe Awuzie 32) Saints- Kevin King

This subject has been a beef of mine for some time. It is about what actually causes the success/failure of a player in the NFL coming in from the college draft or as a rookie FA....and what a bust actually is. Too often, I see commentary regarding a player being a "Bust", "Drafted too high", or "value pick". I absolutely loved how Chris Ballard, new GM for the Colts, responded to this line of thinking in a recent interview. His thoughts mirror my own. Watch the whole thing if you have the time, if not, watch between 6:20 and 7:00 minutes. http://www.colts.com/videos/videos/Chris-Ballard-Full-Pre-Draft-Press-Conference/a087afb8-b066-4157-9e04-2fa9cedb89f4 So, here is what I am asking. Given these criteria, try and rate YOUR order of importance to the actual success of a player. Insert your number in the parenthesis: () Talent () Scheme after acquisition/Position placement () Scheme before acquisition () Player development in regards to technique and game skills () Locker room environment/Team structure () Outside influences/Support (family/nightlife/team city) () Round drafted/rookie FA () Good/bad luck on injuries/Conditioning staff () In game coaching () Work ethic/Drive/Character I believe that player A could go to team A and be a failure while player B could go to team B and be a success....yet switch the teams that the players go to, and the one that succeeds could fail, and vice versa. Yet we put so much on when a player was drafted. It is my opinion that "round drafted/rookie FA" is the least affecting. But when a player fails, it is nearly always the first thing mentioned....especially in regards to the players drafting slot.

Didn't say they couldn't transition...merely pointed out that by position....scheme before draft can have varying degrees of difficulty.

Yes....and a guy who never rarely defense with his hand in the dirt might not have as hard of a transition as a QB that plays primarily shotgun.....so for some positions....Scheme before acquisition is quite important.

Mine is very similar to yours, Razor. (1) Work ethic/Drive/Character (2) Player development in regards to technique and game skills (3) Good/bad luck on injuries / Condition Staff (4) Locker room environment/Team structure (5) Scheme after acquisition/Position placement (6) In game coaching (7) Outside influences/Support (family/nightlife/team city) (8) Talent (9) Scheme before acquisition (10) Round drafted/rookie FA

I like your combining of the categories...was just typing off the top of my head. I'll edit mine. Good response. The stuff in red is QFT.

This has been on my mind for a while, and I just need to say my piece here. I know that by opening my grille, I invite criticism, and I'm ok with that. I just want to be clear and say I am not looking for an argument, just putting my opinion out into the world, but please give your opinion whether you agree or not. The high profile incident where he punched a woman and broke her facial bones after she verbally abused him and hit him, has serious opinions attached to it. I do believe in getting second chances, but I also believe in indicators of serious behavioral tendencies. IMO, we are not talking about just an incident where a young person did something stupid. That cliche does not cover every instance in life. Expressing anger without control can be devastating, if not...life threatening. I would like to interject at this time that this isn't just the fact that she had broken bones in her face that will heal. She could very well have continuing pain, a changed look to her face, as well as lifetime complicated issues such as headaches, hearing loss, and TMJ (Jaw alignment issues). I want to clarify that I am in no way saying that she was right, allowed, or forgiven for her part in whatever happened. Regardless, The inability to realize that devastation of his actions (Mixon), shows a behavioral issue that goes far beyond a young kid making a mistake IMO. He has a second incident where he had issues with a parking citation. At the very least, I would be troubled if the team I follow chose to draft him. If a fan was to say, "I don't care what a player does off the field, I want them to be a monster on the field", I would ask, would you honestly feel that same way if it was your daughter that got her face broken?

Well, Remington Steel television series lasted 5 years. Maybe he could be the face of another tv series after football.

That Cards draft looks goooood.......

Taco Charlton, DE, Michigan Alvin Kamara, RB, Tennessee Jaleel Johnson, DT, Iowa Duke Riley, ILB, LSU Nathan Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh Erik Magnuson, OT, Michigan Jon Toth, C, Kentucky Channing Stribling, CB, Michigan Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State Ethan Cooper, OG, Indiana Pa

Haason Reddick, LB, Temple Charles Harris, OLB, Missouri Montravius Adams, DT, Auburn Samaje Perine, RB, Oklahoma Shaquill Griffin, CB, Central Florida Brian Allen, CB, Utah Elijah Qualis, DT, Washington

With the 245th pick in the 2017 NFL Draft, the Kansas City Chiefs select... Ethan Cooper, OG, Indiana Pa

Has to not get "that hit"

With the 218th pick, the Kansas City Chiefs select: Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State

With the 216th pick, the Kansas City Chiefs select: Channing Stribling, CB, Michigan

bump

Perhaps this will help speed up selections. Listed in order by position w/round. (Numbers to side are for counting purposes only) DeShone Kizer, QB, Notre Dame RD1 Mitchell Trubisky, QB, North Carolina RD1 DeShaun Watson, QB, Clemson RD1 Davis Webb, QB, Cal RD2 Patrick Mahomies, QB, Texas Tech RD3 Nate Peterman, QB, Pittsburgh RD4 Seth Russell, QB, Baylor RD5 Jerod Evans, QB, Virginia Tech RD5 Joshua Dobbs, QB,Tennessee RD5 Brad Kaaya, QB, Miami RD6 Ryan Higgins, QB, Louisiana Tech RD6 Chad Kelly, QB, Ole Miss RD6 Alek Torgersen, QB, Penn RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Mike Williams, WR, Clemson RD1 Corey Davis, WR, Western Michigan RD1 John Ross, WR, Washington RD1 Chad Hansen, WR, California RD3 JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR, USC RD3 Zay Jones, WR, ECU RD3 Chris Godwin, WR, Penn State RD3 Dede Westbrook, WR, Oklahoma RD3 Taywan Taylor, WR, Western Kentucky RD4 Isiah Ford, WR, Virginia Tech RD4 Cooper Kupp, East. Wash. University RD4 Ryan Switzer, WR, North Carolina RD4 Amba Etta-Tawo, WR, Syracuse RD4 ArDarius Stewart, WR, Alabama RD5 K.D. Cannon, WR, Baylor RD5 Carlos Henderson, WR, Louisiana-Tech RD5 Jehu Chesson, WR, Michigan RD5 Noah Brown, WR, Ohio State RD5 Amara Darboh, WR, Michigan RD5 Mack Hollins, WR, North Carolina RD5 Malachi Dupre, WR, LSU RD5 Stacy Coley, WR, Miami RD6 Robert Davis WR Georgia State RD6 Kenny Golladay, WR, Northern Illinois RD6 Chad Williams, WR, Grambling State RD6 DeAngelo Yancey, WR, Purdue RD6 Josh Malone, WR, Tennessee RD6 Brisly Estime, WR Syracuse RD7 Damore'ea Stringfellow, WR, Ole Miss RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Leonard Fournette, RB, LSU RD1 Dalvin Cook, RB, Florida State RD1 Christian McCaffrey, RB, Stanford RD2 Joe Mixon, HB, Oklahoma RD2 Alvin Kamara, RB, Tennessee RD2 Jamal Williams, RB, BYU RD3 Kareem Hunt, RB, Toledo RD3 D'Onta Foreman, RB, Texas RD3 Curtis Samuel, RB, Ohio State RD3 Marlon Mack, RB, USF RD4 Samaja Perine, RB, Oklahoma Wayne Gallman, RB Clemson RD4 James Conner, RB, Pittsburgh RD4 Donnel Pumphrey, RB, San Diego State RD5 Jeremy McNichols, RB, Boise State RD5 Corey Clement, RB, Wisconsin RD5 TJ Logan, RB, North Carolina RD5 Shock Linwood, RB, Baylor RD5 Matt Dayes, RB, NC State RD6 Joe Williams, RB, Utah RD6 Devine Redding, RB, Indiana RD6 Elijah Hood, RB, UNC RD7 Freddie Stevenson, FB, Florida State RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ O.J. Howard, TE, Alabama RD1 David Njoku, TE, Miami RD1 Evan Engram, TE, Mississippi RD2 Jake Butt, TE, Michigan RD2 Gerald Everett, TE, South Alabama RD3 Bucky Hodges, TE, Virginia Tech RD3 Adam Shaheen, TE, Ashland RD3 George Kittle, TE, Iowa RD4 Jordan Leggett, TE, Clemson RD4 Pharaoh Brown, TE, Oregon RD4 Jonnu Smith, TE, Florida International RD4 Michael Roberts, TE, Toledo RD6 Cole Hikutini, TE, Louisville RD6 Jeremy Sprinkle, TE, Arkansas RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Garett Bolles, OT, Utah RD1 Cam Robinson, OT, Alabama RD1 Ryan Ramczyk, OT, Wisconsin RD1 Forrest Lamp, OG, Western Kentucky RD1 Roderick Johnson, OT, Florida State RD2 Dion Dawkins, OT, Temple RD2 Dan Feeney, OG, Indiana RD2 Dorian Johnson, OG, Pittsburgh RD2 Antonio Garcia, OT, Troy RD3 Pat Elflein, C, Ohio State RD3 Ethan Pocic, C, LSU RD3 Taylor Moton, OG, Western Michigan RD3 Nico Siragusa, OG, San Diego State RD3 Chad Wheeler, OT, USC RD3 Isaac Asiata G/C Utah Utes RD3 Adam Bisnowaty OT Pittsburgh RD4 Danny Isadora, OG, Miami RD4 JJ Dielman, C/OG Utah Utes RD4 Jordan Morgan, G, Kutztown RD4 Julie'n Davenport, OT, Bucknell RD4 Jessamen Dunker, OG, Tennessee State RD4 Tyler Orlosky, C, West Virginia RD4 Will Holden, T, Vanderbilt RD5 Kyle Fuller, C, Baylor RD5 Sam Tevi, OT, Utah RD5 Eric Magnuson, OT, Michigan RD5 Avery Gennesy, OT, Texas A&M RD5 John Toth, C, Kentucky RD5 Conor McDermott, OT, UCLA RD5 David Sharpe, OT, Florida RD5 Damien Mama, OG, USC RD6 Parker Collins, C, Appalachian State RD6 Casey Dunn, C, Jacksonville State RD7 Fred Zerblis, OG, Colorado State RD7 Chase Roullier, OG, Wyoming RD7 Zach Banner, OT, USC RD7 Brad Seaton, OT, Villanova RD7 Dustin Stanton, OG, Oregon State RD7 Jerry Ugokwe, OT, William & Mary RD7 Ethan Cooper, OG, Indiana Pa RD7 Michael Coe, OG, North Dakota RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Jonathan Allen, DT, Alabama RD1 Caleb Brantley, DT, Florida RD1 Jarron Jones, DT, Notre Dame RD2 Montravius Adams, DT, Auburn RD3 Jaleel Johson, DT, Iowa RD3 Vincent Taylor. DT. Oklahoma State RD3 Carlos Watkins, DT, Clemson RD3 Davon Godchaux, DT, LSU RD4 Larry Ogunjobi, DT, Charlotte RD4 Eddie Vanderdoes, DT, UCLA RD4 Ryan Glasglow, DT, Michigan RD5 Stevie Tu'ikolovatu, NT, USC RD5 Elijah Qualls, DT, Washington RD5 Chunky Clements, DT, Illinois RD6 Charles Walker, DL, Oklahoma RD6 Nazair Jones, DT, North Carolina RD6 D.J. Jones, DT, Ole Miss RD7 Joey Ivie, DT, Florida RD7 Tanzel Smart, DT, Tulane RD7 Grover Stewart, DL, Albany State RD7 Jeremiah Ledbetter, DL, Oklahoma RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Myles Garrett, DE, Texas A&M RD1 Solomon Thomas, DE, Stanford RD1 Derek Barnett, DE, Tennessee RD1 Malik McDowell, DE, Michigan State RD1 Carl Lawson, DE, Auburn RD1 Taco Charlton, DE, Michigan RD1 Tim Williams, DE/OLB, Alabama RD2 Demarcus Walker, DE, Florida State RD2 Chris Wormley, DE, Michigan RD2 Dalvin Tomlinson, DE, Alabama RD2 Dawuane Smoot, DE, Illinois RD3 Daeshon Hall, DE, Texas A&M Aggies RD3 Tanoh Kpassagnon, DE, Villanova RD3 Tarrell Basham, DE, Ohio RD4 Trey Hendrickson, DE, Florida Atlantic RD4 Deatrich Wise Jr., DE, Arkansas RD5 Keionta Davis, DE, Chattanooga RD6 Avery Moss, DE/LB, Youngstown State RD6 Dylan Donahue, DE/LB, West Georgia RD7 Josh Carraway, DE/LB, TCU RD7 Josh Posley, DE, Ball State RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Reuben Foster, LB, Alabama RD1 Haason Reddick, LB, Temple RD1 Zach Cunningham, LB, Vanderbilt RD1 Takkarist McKinley, OLB, UCLA RD1 Charles Harris, OLB, Missouri RD2 T.J. Watt, OLB, Wisconsin RD2 Jarrad Davis, LB, Florida RD2 Raekwon McMillan, ILB, Ohio State RD2 Jordan Willis, OLB, Kansas State RD3 Ejuan Price, OLB, Pittsburgh RD3 Ryan Anderson, OLB, Alabama RD3 Tyus Bowser, OLB, Houston RD3 Anthony Walker Jr, OLB, Northwestern RD3 Carroll Phillips, OLB, Illinois RD3 Kendell Beckwith, LB, LSU RD3 Conor Harris ILB Lindenwood RD3 Duke Riley, ILB, LSU RD3 Tanner Vallejo, ILB, Boise State RD4 Derek Rivers, OLB, Youngstown State RD4 Alex Anzalone, LB, Florida RD5 Jayon Brown, LB, UCLA RD5 Samson Ebukam, OLB, Eastern Washington RD5 Ben Boulware, LB, Clemson RD5 Steven Taylor, OLB, Houston RD5 Joe Mathis, OLB, Washington RD6 Jalen Reeves-Maybin, LB, Tennessee RD6 Pita Taumoepenu, OLB, Utah RD6 Blair Brown, LB, Ohio RD6 Dylan Cole, LB, Missouri State RD6 Kenneth Olugbode, LB, Colorado RD7 Richie Brown LB Mississippi St. RD7 Vince Biegel, OLB, Wisconsin RD7 James Onwualu, LB, Notre Dame RD7 Ben Gedeon, LB, Michigan RD7 Marquel Lee, ILB, Wake Forest RD7 Eric Wilson, LB, Cincinnati RD7 ------------------------------------------------------------ Marshon Lattimore, CB, Ohio State RD1 Sidney Jones, CB, Washington RD1 Jalen Tabor, CB, Florida RD1 Adoree' Jackson, CB, USC RD2 Gareon Conley, CB, Ohio State RD2 Marlon Humphrey, CB, Alabama RD2 Tre'Davious White, CB, LSU RD2 Quincy Wilson, CB, Florida RD2 Chidobe Awuzie, CB, Colorado RD2 Kevin King, CB, Washington RD2 Cordrea Tankersley, CB, Clemson RD2 Fabian Moreau, CB, UCLA RD2 Ahkello Witherspoon, CB, Colorado RD2 Desmond King, CB, Iowa RD3 Cameron Sutton, CB, Tennessee RD3 Damontae Kazee, CB, S.D. State Aztecs RD3 Jourdan Lewis, CB, Michigan RD3 Rasul Douglas. CB. West Virginia RD3 Jalen Myrick, CB, Minnesota RD4 Howard Wilson, CB, Houston RD4 Corn Elder, CB, Miami RD4 Shaquill Griffin, CB, Central Florida RD4 Brian Allen, CB, Utah RD4 Brendan Langley, CB, Lamar Nate Hairston, CB, Temple RD5 William Likely III, DB, Maryland RD6 Joshua Holsey, CB, Auburn RD6 Jeremy Cutrer, CB, Middle Tenn State U. RD6 Channing Stribling, CB, Michigan RD6 Treston DeCoud, DB, Oregon State RD7 Marquez White, CB, FSU RD7 -------------------------------------------------------------- Malik Hooker, S, Ohio State RD1 Jamal Adams, S, LSU RD1 Jabrill Peppers, S, Michigan RD1 Budda Baker, S, Washington RD2 Obi Melifonwu, S, Connecticut RD2 Marcus Williams, S, Utah RD2 Josh Jones, S, North Carolina State RD3 Eddie Jackson, S, Alabama RD3 John Johnson, S, Boston College RD4 Justin Evans, S Texas A&M RD4 Tedric Thompson, S, Colorado RD4 Nate Gerry, S, Nebreska RD4 Delano Hill, S, Michigan RD5 Rayshawn Jenkins, S, Miami RD5 Marcus Maye, S, Florida RD5 Lorenzo Jerome, S, St. Francis RD5 Josh Harvey-Clemons, S, Louisville RD5 Montae Nicholson, S, Michigan State RD6 Orion Stewart, S, Baylor RD7 Jadar Johnson, SS, Clemson S RD7 (250) Weston Steelhammer, SS, Air Force RD7 (Mr. Irrelevant) -------------------------------------------------------------- Zane Gonzalez, K, Arizona State RD5 Justin Vogel, P, Miami RD6

This could be a key piece. He moves well for large man. It is going to end up being about his health, and effort. He has the skills to make a difference on this defense. Ohio St getting some rep on the Colts....

If Thomas fell to 14....the Colts better do what it takes to move up a spot.

I am in my late 50's, and I'm dating a woman in her early 50's. The has never been better.

With the 180th pick in the 2017 NFL draft... the Kansas City Chiefs select... John Toth, C, Kentucky