NFL Not Expected to Fix Calvin Johnson Rule

[oochymp 2,393]

well, no, they had secured it, but they were going to the ground while securing it, which means they have to maintain control through the ground, it's not enough to secure it before you hit the ground because that's way too subjective, it's a lot clearer to say if you fall to the ground while catching the ball then you have to get back up with it without letting the ball hit the ground

[BwareDWare94 723]

Re-watch the two plays and apply my wording to it. It makes plenty of sense that those two plays should negate these ridiculous rules. Both players had clear control of the football long enough to have transferred it to one hand that also had clear control, Dez in extending toward the pylon and Megatron to keep his balance. Both were catches. Both should count as catches. It makes sense. It's significantly different from the plays that the rule normally affects.

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

The Dez play being considered a catch is laughable, imo. Comparing it to the Calvin play is even more laughable.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap3000000456759/Did-Dez-catch-it

 

-Dez had the ball as his feet touched, but didn't hold the ball as he hit the turf and the ball came out and touched the ground during the process.

vs.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d81a77070/Controversial-call-on-Megatron-non-TD

-Calvin had clear control and lunged after he touched down and slid on his ass in the endzone before the ball touched the ground.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Zack_of_Steel

[Thanatos 2,847]

After watching the Dez play again- does the ball ever touch the ground? Curious now.

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

I think it clearly does and apparently the refs had enough to overturn the call.

 

I've seen many people say otherwise, though, so maybe I'm crazy.

[Thanatos 2,847]

Is there another angle? It doesn't look like it does in that video.

 

To me, honestly, both look like catches. Megatron's is far worse though. As soon as he has two feet down, with uncontested possession, in the endzone, the play should be over. That's a touchdown, right there. He then further falls onto his ass, then brings his arm, then slams the ball into the ground, and then loses the ball. That is an easy catch.

 

Dez... while there's an argument, I still watch that play and think he caught the ball.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Thanatos19

[oochymp 2,393]

Is there another angle? It doesn't look like it does in that video.

 

To me, honestly, both look like catches. Megatron's is far worse though. As soon as he has two feet down, with uncontested possession, in the endzone, the play should be over. That's a touchdown, right there. He then further falls onto his ass, then brings his arm, then slams the ball into the ground, and then loses the ball. That is an easy catch.

 

Dez... while there's an argument, I still watch that play and think he caught the ball.

I posted these images in the game thread, but I'll throw them up here as well, in succession:

 

looks pretty clear that the ball hit the ground then came out, you could make the argument that he had secured the ball before he hit the ground, but that's not the way the rule is written and writing the rule that way would introduce a whole host of other issues

 

I actually think it's incredibly similar to the Calvin Johnson no-catch with the exception that you could argue Johnson was more intentional about putting the ball on the ground, but that's irrelevant when you're looking at this rule

[Thanatos 2,847]

Thank you for that, yes that makes it seem very clear that it hit the ground.

[BwareDWare94 723]

In my opinion, Dez's extension toward the endzone (which is the only reason the ball even had a chance at coming out) was an extension with clear control of the football with one hand, after clearly securing control of the ball with two hands before transferring it to his one hand. That is what makes it similar to the Megatron play, as both players had already gone through the catch process in their minds and were extending the football for different reasons. They're very similar. The only difference is that Megatron's catch happened in the endzone and he stuck his hand down to keep his balance. Dez had landed on two feet, moved forward with two feet, and was trying to score a touchdown.

 

Under no circumstances should these have been incomplete passes when you factor in the sheer athletic ability of these two men. They had both secured the football, were extending the ball for different reasons, and had moved forward as if they had control of the ball, or whatever the stupid fucking wording is (as we all know now--"football move" is nowhere in the language anymore).

 

Whatever the rule is, it needs to be changed because some players are clearly capable of going through the process---catch, secure, extend, or catch, secure, YAC when they're not near the endzone--faster than others. Dez and Megatron were essentially punished for completing the process and moving on to the next step much quicker than normal individuals. These plays need to be catches. There is absolutely a way the NFL can separate these instances from the instances the rule is actually meant to prevent. It's not as complicated as it sounds.

Edited April 9, 2015 by BwareDWare94

[BwareDWare94 723]

All things considered, if Dez hadn't been selfish and just secured the ball knowing he had a first down, DeMarco Murray would have scored and Dallas likely would have been playing in the Super Bowl, as they wouldn't have collapsed against Seattle and their "shittiest winning performance in Conference Championship Game history."

 

What could have been if not for a fucking moronic rule.

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

In my opinion, Dez's extension toward the endzone (which is the only reason the ball even had a chance at coming out) was an extension with clear control of the football with one hand, after clearly securing control of the ball with two hands before transferring it to his one hand. That is what makes it similar to the Megatron play, as both players had already gone through the catch process in their minds and were extending the football for different reasons. They're very similar. The only difference is that Megatron's catch happened in the endzone and he stuck his hand down to keep his balance. Dez had landed on two feet, moved forward with two feet, and was trying to score a touchdown.

 

Under no circumstances should these have been incomplete passes when you factor in the sheer athletic ability of these two men. They had both secured the football, were extending the ball for different reasons, and had moved forward as if they had control of the ball, or whatever the stupid fucking wording is (as we all know now--"football move" is nowhere in the language anymore).

 

Whatever the rule is, it needs to be changed because some players are clearly capable of going through the process---catch, secure, extend, or catch, secure, YAC when they're not near the endzone--faster than others. Dez and Megatron were essentially punished for completing the process and moving on to the next step much quicker than normal individuals. These plays need to be catches. There is absolutely a way the NFL can separate these instances from the instances the rule is actually meant to prevent. It's not as complicated as it sounds.

No, Bware. Did you watch the video I posted?

 

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap3000000456759/Did-Dez-catch-it

 

He doesn't lunge at all. His momentum took him to the ground in one motion and he lost control of it as the ball hit the field. It even popped out of his hands.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Zack_of_Steel

[Thanatos 2,847]

All things considered, if Dez hadn't been selfish and just secured the ball knowing he had a first down, DeMarco Murray would have scored and Dallas likely would have been playing in the Super Bowl, as they wouldn't have collapsed against Seattle and their "shittiest winning performance in Conference Championship Game history."

 

What could have been if not for a fucking moronic rule.

 

Right, because the Dallas defense could totally stop Aaron Rodgers with 4:30 on the clock. Oh wait. They couldn't even get the ball back for Romo to get one more shot.

 

Don't kid yourself. If Dez scores, Rodgers marches right down the field and the Pack win anyway.

 

And sure, just assume Dallas is able to do to Seattle what the Packers did.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Thanatos19