Update - Holdout over: Chris Johnson agrees to terms

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

I can list off individuals if you want... But together they make a unit. . Tramon Williams, AJ Hawk, Clay Matthews, Erik Walden, Charlie Peprah, Charles Woodson. Terrible. Straight up awful. Rust if you will.. Your words, not mine.

 

 

He didn't have a preseason for a reason though. Nobodies fault but his own. And the rest of the league had a shortened time to get ready as well. Lots of players playing poorly. Lots of them playing well. Nature of the league, CJ is just one of them playing very bad right now.

 

No, those players played in the pre-season and were with their team in training camp. Which while, yes, is CJ's fault, still makes your comparison invalid..

 

 

What else does he do well? We've talked about this before and you have gotten beaten down by the same argument over and over. He is trash in pass pro and anywhere from sub-par to mediocre in receiving if that even.

 

He is extremely quick, and has high end top speed. What else is there to say? If he had a lot of power... or elite level vision... or.. whatever else there is, he could make up for the shortcomings of a bad line and some "rust".

 

And I am not sure which are stronger... My hater shades, or your homer ones.

 

In a thread during the off-season, I made a post with a couple videos and pointed out other things CJ did well when in a debate with you about it. Find that thread and read it, you never did respond or make a rebuttal after I made that post, so I've gotten beaten down by the same argument over and over? No, you just ignored my argument cause you didn't want to admit where you were wrong. The thread had something to do with the NFL's top 100 currently playing players if I remember right..anyway..

 

His problem isn't that he doesn't have his elite vision or speed anymore, it's that he's trying to get used to the game again..do you not listen to former players(and current ones), plus former/current coaches talk about how important pre-season is? How it's crucial to have it so the players can get up to game speed? I'm not pulling that out of my ass. It's well documented.

 

Yes, it's CJ's fault he's not ready. I've agreed with that the entire time. However, he hasn't lost what made him an elite back the previous three seasons..he, again, is shaking the rust off from not having a training camp or pre-season.

 

Even as hard as players in the NFL work out in the off-season, they're not in football shape til training camp and pre-season is over. You hear that from coaches and players all the time as well..

Edited September 27, 2011 by .AirMcNair.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

No, those players played in the pre-season and were with their team in training camp. Which while, yes, is CJ's fault, still makes your comparison invalid..

 

 

 

 

In a thread during the off-season, I made a post with a couple videos and pointed out other things CJ did well when in a debate with you about it. Find that thread and read it, you never did respond or make a rebuttal after I made that post, so I've gotten beaten down by the same argument over and over? No, you just ignored my argument cause you didn't want to admit where you were wrong. The thread had something to do with the NFL's top 100 currently playing players if I remember right..anyway..

 

His problem isn't that he doesn't have his elite vision or speed anymore, it's that he's trying to get used to the game again..do you not listen to former players(and current ones), plus former/current coaches talk about how important pre-season is? How it's crucial to have it so the players can get up to game speed? I'm not pulling that out of my ass. It's well documented.

 

Yes, it's CJ's fault he's not ready. I've agreed with that the entire time. However, he hasn't lost what made him an elite back the previous three seasons..he, again, is shaking the rust off from not having a training camp or pre-season.

 

Even as hard as players in the NFL work out in the off-season, they're not in football shape til training camp and pre-season is over. You hear that from coaches and players all the time as well..

 

Posting highlight videos of CJ's best plays a strong argument makes not. I could go find awesome plays Jamarcus Russel made, that doesn't make him any better of a QB? Your response was so completely irrelevant and asinine that it didn't deserve a response.

 

I just want you to admit that he is awful right now. Arguably the worst starting RB in the league. I am trying to think of someone worse and it's not easy.

 

I am not asking you to concede that he is an awful player... or that he won't improve.

 

I am simply asking you to be honest with yourself.

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

Posting highlight videos of CJ's best plays a strong argument makes not. I could go find awesome plays Jamarcus Russel made, that doesn't make him any better of a QB? Your response was so completely irrelevant and asinine that it didn't deserve a response.

 

I just want you to admit that he is awful right now. Arguably the worst starting RB in the league. I am trying to think of someone worse and it's not easy.

 

I am not asking you to concede that he is an awful player... or that he won't improve.

 

I am simply asking you to be honest with yourself.

 

Well what do you want me to use to show what CJ does well? Runs where he gets 2 yards? I'm sorry, but he's not Jerome Bettis. His specialty is getting in space and making things happen. It'd be like trying to make a case for Barry Sanders as the best ever using only his goal line/power runs.

 

And I've admitted he's playing badly right now. And the Titans have the worst running game in football, which CJ has been a huge reason why of so far. However, people acting like CJ's career is over and he's shit and is just folding it in are ridiculous. CJ will be fine..it's this line that worries me the most. We've got 2 O-line HOFers on staff and we can't manage at least to be decent at run blocking? Like wtf?

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Well what do you want me to use to show what CJ does well? Runs where he gets 2 yards? I'm sorry, but he's not Jerome Bettis. His specialty is getting in space and making things happen. It'd be like trying to make a case for Barry Sanders as the best ever using only his goal line/power runs.

 

And I've admitted he's playing badly right now. And the Titans have the worst running game in football, which CJ has been a huge reason why of so far. However, people acting like CJ's career is over and he's shit and is just folding it in are ridiculous. CJ will be fine..it's this line that worries me the most. We've got 2 O-line HOFers on staff and we can't manage at least to be decent at run blocking? Like wtf?

 

Again... Showing highlight videos of the best of the best plays is proof of nothing. You can find highlights anywhere on any player doing anything. And that's not the same thing... Being that we aren't talking about Barry Sanders, nor CJ's place amongst the best over. There is nothing similar between the two things you tried comparing.

 

And secondly... No one is saying his career. You jumping to conclusions, because you are upset that CJ sucks and people are calling him out on it.

 

He could rush for 200 yards next week.. Nobody is saying he is not capable or able to do so.

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

Again... Showing highlight videos of the best of the best plays is proof of nothing. You can find highlights anywhere on any player doing anything. And that's not the same thing... Being that we aren't talking about Barry Sanders, nor CJ's place amongst the best over. There is nothing similar between the two things you tried comparing.

 

And secondly... No one is saying his career. You jumping to conclusions, because you are upset that CJ sucks and people are calling him out on it.

 

He could rush for 200 yards next week.. Nobody is saying he is not capable or able to do so.

 

Well, how do you expect me to prove what he can do well? You don't want to take my word for it, so I used video evidence. You don't want to take the video evidence, so what else do you want? Coaches talk about it in their press conferences before playing the Titans, do you not take their word for it as well? I'm pretty sure you're just damned determined to hate the guy. And what I was getting at with the Barry Sanders point is comparing the stupidity of each situation, not the exact situations themselves. If you can't see CJ's elite elusiveness and vision when watching him play over the past 3 years, which you'd have to be pretty blind not to, then just listen to what coaches and players say about the guy. If you don't want to believe them, I don't know what to tell you, honestly.

 

People in the media and on different forums, not just here, keep talking about CJ like he's quitting because he got his money. I'm not jumping to conclusions. Upset that people are calling CJ out? Even though I do it myself? Lol, ok, that makes sense.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Well, how do you expect me to prove what he can do well? You don't want to take my word for it, so I used video evidence. You don't want to take the video evidence, so what else do you want? Coaches talk about it in their press conferences before playing the Titans, do you not take their word for it as well? I'm pretty sure you're just damned determined to hate the guy. And what I was getting at with the Barry Sanders point is comparing the stupidity of each situation, not the exact situations themselves. If you can't see CJ's elite elusiveness and vision when watching him play over the past 3 years, which you'd have to be pretty blind not to, then just listen to what coaches and players say about the guy. If you don't want to believe them, I don't know what to tell you, honestly.

 

People in the media and on different forums, not just here, keep talking about CJ like he's quitting because he got his money. I'm not jumping to conclusions. Upset that people are calling CJ out? Even though I do it myself? Lol, ok, that makes sense.

 

I just find it... convenient. That he has elite vision and elusiveness when his Oline is playing at an elite level... but it just... disappears when they aren't.

 

I don't think that is such an outlandish observation. Sorry.

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

I just find it... convenient. That he has elite vision and elusiveness when his Oline is playing at an elite level... but it just... disappears when they aren't.

 

I don't think that is such an outlandish observation. Sorry.

 

I'm going to use 08, 09 and 10 in this, not counting this year:

 

In 2008, the run blocking line was pretty damn good. Mawae was still at a solid level, Amano was average, but he could do his job, Roos and Stewart were playing at an elite level and Jake Scott was pretty good. The Titans benefited from having a great combination in CJ and White, and while it was obvious CJ was the better runner of the 2, keeping him fresh was a great strategy, and the mix up was always nice. Everything went well in the running game that year.

 

2009, however, is a different story. Mawae's play went down hill, which made Amano's averageness at LG shine because he was the one who was asked to pick up Mawae's slack, and of course that also effected Scott to a point. Roos, for whatever reason, dropped off in play. Pass and run blocking. I don't know what happened to him, and while he wasn't playing terribly, it wasn't at the elite level of 08. David Stewart was the only one who carried his elite play over from 08.

 

And I think you'll notice, when watching CJ break long runs in 09, it wasn't him just out running everyone..he had to use vision and his elusiveness, and on a couple runs, Bills goal line TD and Jags long TD come to mind, he had to put a bit of power in to it as well. CJ worked for his long runs in 2009, and I'll debate to the end anyone who thinks he had a cake walk on them thanks to his offensive line, cause that was so far from the case.

 

2010, while still a pretty good year from CJ, just wasn't what he was in 09 and 08, I'll admit that. Wasn't only the run blocking decreasing in play as well, it was at times CJ looking to hit the big run too often. He settled down as the year went on, but early on it was quite obvious. Almost comparable to Asante Samuel..who would get too antsy at times trying to go for a pick and get beat.

 

However, CJ had to work good bit harder to get his yards in 2010, with no passing game to speak of, the blocking being bad, and like I said earlier, his trying to hit the big play too often.

 

I know you don't like highlight videos, but if you honestly want to see how hard CJ had to work in 2010, watch this:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKxjJu7H_FQ

 

His game vs the Colts that year, is probably my favorite performance from him in his career. The sole reason we were in that game in the end.

 

The epitome of his 2010 year was the run vs the Chargers, which comes in at 1:26 on that video. Struggling for every yard. Yeah, he still had 1 or 2 runs where he just made a guy missed then used his speed for the rest, but a lot of his plays were where he had to juke one or 2, break a tackle, us his vision, etc.

 

I think using the "elite run blocking line" for his success is a decent explanation for 2008..but for 09 and 10? He worked for his yards.

Edited September 27, 2011 by .AirMcNair.

[oochymp 2,393]

Very well possible. I don't think any of us expect him to average 30 yards over the next 13 games. lol

you certainly seem to have that expectation, or something similar

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

According to ESPN Insider(from a poster on footballsfuture):

 

Titans offensive line has favorable run blocking on under 30% of our runs. Tampa was last in the league last year with nearly 34%.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

you certainly seem to have that expectation, or something similar

 

When I have said that? Making assumptions and then basing your replies off of them is never a smart thing to do. I have said over and over that he is fully capable of hitting 100 yards in his next game or any after that.

 

What I am saying is... He is RIGHT NOW. One of, if not the worst, starting RBs in the league.

 

What he does next week, or a month from now is really irrelevant and something I am not even attempting to argue.

[oochymp 2,393]

When I have said that? Making assumptions and then basing your replies off of them is never a smart thing to do. I have said over and over that he is fully capable of hitting 100 yards in his next game or any after that.

 

What I am saying is... He is RIGHT NOW. One of, if not the worst, starting RBs in the league.

 

What he does next week, or a month from now is really irrelevant and something I am not even attempting to argue.

I can say Curtis Painter could lead the Colts to the playoffs if I want to, it doesn't mean I actually believe it, and based on the bulk of your comments (by which I mean just about every one that's not a direct statement that he could break out at any time) you've done nothing but trash him, which makes it seem like you think he's absolutely awful, as in irredeemably awful. Also note that I put no words into your mouth, I simply stated that you seem to think so and, as I said, most of your comments in this thread have made it seem like you have an expectation that CJ will not get out of his current funk, but there is a possibility that he might. Those of us here who are Titans fans, well me anyway, I guess I can't speak for anyone else, are very confident (optimistic, if you prefer) that CJ will break through, but acknowledge that there is a possibility that he might not.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I can say Curtis Painter could lead the Colts to the playoffs if I want to, it doesn't mean I actually believe it, and based on the bulk of your comments (by which I mean just about every one that's not a direct statement that he could break out at any time) you've done nothing but trash him, which makes it seem like you think he's absolutely awful, as in irredeemably awful. Also note that I put no words into your mouth, I simply stated that you seem to think so and, as I said, most of your comments in this thread have made it seem like you have an expectation that CJ will not get out of his current funk, but there is a possibility that he might. Those of us here who are Titans fans, well me anyway, I guess I can't speak for anyone else, are very confident (optimistic, if you prefer) that CJ will break through, but acknowledge that there is a possibility that he might not.

 

Anything before the bolded part just wasn't worth the time to read. Instead of taking what I say and then telling me what it seems like I am saying... Why not just read what I AM saying? And if you are confused on what I am saying. Ask.

 

And that's the first reasonably decent thing I have heard/read a Titans fan think about CJ. At least you didn't follow it up with... "our terrible oline...fullback...rusty".

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

Anything before the bolded part just wasn't worth the time to read. Instead of taking what I say and then telling me what it seems like I am saying... Why not just read what I AM saying? And if you are confused on what I am saying. Ask.

 

And that's the first reasonably decent thing I have heard/read a Titans fan think about CJ. At least you didn't follow it up with... "our terrible oline...fullback...rusty".

 

Yep, god forbid the use of facts.

[oochymp 2,393]

Anything before the bolded part just wasn't worth the time to read. Instead of taking what I say and then telling me what it seems like I am saying... Why not just read what I AM saying? And if you are confused on what I am saying. Ask.

 

And that's the first reasonably decent thing I have heard/read a Titans fan think about CJ. At least you didn't follow it up with... "our terrible oline...fullback...rusty".

I thought the part above what you bolded was actually a well thought out explanation of what I meant by my previous post, but to each his own I suppose

[Guest MikeyDay]

Its obvious how bad our run blocking has been. Amano is too soft and so is jake scott. In all three games i seen both of them get knocked back constantly.. no need to debate just watch the highlights of games and ull see em get swamped.

 

Im more worried about the oline then CJ. Our rbs cant even get back to the line without being hit.. we need to draft a center or guard for future sake. CJ doesnt have that burst but hell get it back. AirMcnair i def agreed with wut u said. Also we are a passing team so i know we arent trying to run the ball like we have. I expect him to be back to speed by the bye week. Which is in three weeks i believe.

[Vin+ 3,121]

According to Pete Prisco of CBSSports.com, Chris Johnson's early-season issues are the result of poor run-blocking as opposed to missing training camp.

 

After reviewing film of last week's game, Prisco noted that the Broncos defense had backfield penetration of 10 of Johnson's 13 carries. There's no question that Johnson has been out of sync with his blockers, which goes a long way toward explaining his hesitancy to hit holes through three games. The Titans are last in the NFL in rushing, averaging just 51.7 yards per game. That figure was at 107.9 yards per last year behind Pro Football Focus' 32nd-ranked run blocking. CJ2K has nowhere to go but up once he gets back in sync.

 

Source: CBSSports.com

[Guest MikeyDay]

^ 32nd last yr. And this yr its the same. Me n air def said CJ rusty too but the oline was horrible at run blocking. Told yall. They better drop amano sorry ass

[GA_Eagle 595]

I'm having trouble figuring out what you're taking issue with JD.

 

Titans fans in this thread have basically stated that, yes, the running game has sucked and provided reasons to be hopeful that it'll turn around. What else do you want?

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

I'm having trouble figuring out what you're taking issue with JD.

 

Titans fans in this thread have basically stated that, yes, the running game has sucked and provided reasons to be hopeful that it'll turn around. What else do you want?

 

It's clear that he wants to force his opinion so much that the Titans listen, they cut CJ, and then it allows the Packers to sign him.

 

I've figured out his dastardly plan.

[Glanvilles Grits 142]

I hope CJ doesn't start doing better. Not because I don't like him, or I hate on the Titans. Simply because I feel like if he doesn't perform this year, and DeAngelo Williams continues to under-perform, it's going to bring down the price of the bigger running backs in the league. And I'm ok with that!

[Guest MikeyDay]

I hope CJ doesn't start doing better. Not because I don't like him, or I hate on the Titans. Simply because I feel like if he doesn't perform this year, and DeAngelo Williams continues to under-perform, it's going to bring down the price of the bigger running backs in the league. And I'm ok with that!

Someone doesnt want to resign Turner..