NFL Investigates Saints RE: Their "Bounty System"

[Eefluxx 113]

No. Just no.

 

Talking about taking his head off, hitting him under the chin, etc., yes- that *could* be ascribed to just normal, crazy, pump your team up, talk.

 

Saying to target the guy's ACL? No. That is way over the line, and shows that he wanted his team to *hurt* the Niners. Williams should be banned for life, and if Payton was in the room when this was going on, so should he.

 

The guy who released the audio, Sean Pamphilon I think his name was, has said that Payton and Loomis were nowhere near this. Vitt was in the room and informed Payton of it and payton and Loomis (reported by Schefter) went to Williams and said to basically cut it out.

 

The Saints are saying (as did Vitt in his appeal) that Williams went rogue knowing he was going to be fired after the season regardless.

 

Pamphilon in his blog on his website has also stated that Williams several times has stated he had a "Fuck You" clause in his contracts wherever he goes basically stating that he runs the defense and noone can tell him differently. "If you don't like it tough shit." (Joe Gibbs has stated he never knew what Williams did on defense)

 

I agree with Milla (I think he said this)(actuall after rereading it it was Milla and not ChrisD my apologies) in that the appeal was more about getting more time to get a plan together for the season than getting the suspension removed overall.

 

I do feel both Payton and Loomis do still deserve suspension for the simple fact they had no control over one of their assistants and they should have. If they did continue to get reports from Vitt that this was still going on after they told Williams to stop they should have just fired him and moved on. I can understand tho since they weren't told about being investigated the second time until right before the Lions playoff game but Vitt should have told them throughout the season that hey he is still doing this.

 

Rumor mill says (per the Dan Patrick show) that Gregg Williams apology was rejected by the NFL and the NFL wrote him a new apology to use to the media which is the one we got.

 

Also, am I the only one to find it funny that Roger Goodell in his interview with Adam Schefter right after he handed out the supsensions says that they were heavy because Payton lied about it. But then the next sentence out of his mouth is If he didn't know about it he should have. So which is it? Did he know and lie or did he not know and should have?

 

Question I would like to ask the members here. Are you really mad and angry about the "tarnishing of the shield?" as Roger puts it or are you just angry at Payton because you don't like the "brash, arrogant asshole" of a coach and are happy you don't have to put up with him for a year?

 

As for proof, (since this got brought up again) yes this is proof that Williams is an idiot (he knew he was being recorded). But their still hasn't been any proof brought against the players who supposedly carried out his intentions. I don't recall any players in that locker room screaming "Hell yeah" and "Kill him" and "tear his fucking ACL out" It was rather quiet by the players. Which is the proof alot of Saints fans are waiting to see.

 

50,000 pages and 18,000 documents? Has anyone added that up yet?

 

Well go with half the team being defense. that would be about 26 players.

 

So that is 231 documents per player. 77 per year in the 3 year span per person. Not counting playoff games thats about 5 documents per defensive player per game. Considering how many personal files we got and "cart offs" or injuries we caused I don't see it happening that they have that much. Also consider not every defensive player is active so you would have to take them out of the equation as well.

 

I'm not condoning Williams, I think he will serve his time however long it is and he will get another chance, if Jeff Fischer is still coaching anyways.

 

I do beleive Payton and Loomis and Vitt should all be suspended for whatever part Roger feels they played as well as the players that they have proof of.

 

I do also find it funny that in 2009 people on here were laughing at Favre and the Vikings over "remember me shots" and now are condeming the Saints over the exact same "remember me shots" calling them "bounty hits"

 

Its football, its violent. If it happens within the framework of the rules so be it.

 

Before March 2nd people were condeming Goodell for "pussyfying" the NFL. After bountygate people are praising Goodell for "pussyfying" the NFL. Which is it?

 

 

Sorry long post and rant

Edited April 7, 2012 by Eefluxx

[Maverick 791]

I was listening to MAD DOG Radio on Sirius XM on the way into work this morning and my .02 on the whole situation:

 

Williams should not be banned for life. I agree with the suspension indefinitely, but this doesn't call for a banning. As the guy stated on the radio, Williams is taking all the crap for this but everybody was a part of it. No current players from the Saints or the NFL are saying they are completely app hauled by this news of a "bounty system." That's because there is definitely other teams doing it. Maybe not all 32 teams, but these bounty systems are out there. The Saints were just the unlucky ones to be found out.

 

However, I will call out Williams with the audio I heard of him laughing about his team injuring three QBs. You want to tell your guys to legally hit harder on star players and try to take them out of the game - ya know, call me sadistic, but it's a sport and you're trying to win, so I don't have a problem with it. But to laugh about it just gives the impression that it goes far beyond the idea of "winning" for Williams - and that is something that needs to be addressed.

 

I know my thoughts on this aren't completely to one side and different levels of what's okay and not, but again, just my .02.

[SteVo+ 3,702]

@AlbertBreer:

 

NFL upholds discipline in Saints case for Payton, Vitt, Loomis and club, though financial penalties could be reduced.

 

@AdamSchefter:

 

Sean Payton's entire discipline stands, but Mickey Loomis and Joe Vitt's financial penalties could be reduced.

Sean Payton’s suspension without pay for the 2012 NFL season will begin on April 16.

The suspensions without pay of Mickey Loomis for eight games and Joe Vitt for six games will begin at the end of the preseason.

At end of suspensions, Commissioner will review status of each of the three individuals to determine their eligibility for reinstatement.

[Eefluxx 113]

This guy on his blog (obviously a Saints fan) has basically summed up my feelings on this matter.

 

http://saintswin.blogspot.com/2012/04/are-saints-being-railroaded.html

 

I think it is a good read and tho it won't change alot of peoples minds is worth reading.

[Thanatos 2,847]

This guy on his blog (obviously a Saints fan) has basically summed up my feelings on this matter.

 

http://saintswin.blogspot.com/2012/04/are-saints-being-railroaded.html

 

I think it is a good read and tho it won't change alot of peoples minds is worth reading.

 

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They admitted it was going on. That's how we know. The coaches, Greg Williams in particular, has apologized for it. The league does have hard evidence.

 

We have audio of Greg Williams saying to go after Crabtree's ACL, with eyewitness testimony that he was rubbing bills in-between his fingers while saying so.

 

I'm sorry, but Saints fans need to get off this train.

 

The idea that Greg Williams is lying and admitting to something he didn't actually do in order to save his NFL career is ludicrous in the extreme. If he didn't actually do anything, why would his career be in jeopardy in the first place? Because the league wants to make an example out of one organization just so they can say, "Hey, we told these guys to stop it," when lawsuits for concussions come down the line in a few years even though that organization did *nothing wrong*? What, did they just pull the Saints name out of a hat? Is that really what this guy is espousing as a legitimate theory?

 

Come on, son.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Thanatos19

[funnygunny 521]

I heard the NFL is out to get the Saints because they're not generating enough revenue in New Orleans for the NFL.

 

 

oh gawd, conspiracy theorists in the NFL too

 

[Eefluxx 113]

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...

 

They admitted it was going on. That's how we know. The coaches, Greg Williams in particular, has apologized for it. The league does have hard evidence.

 

We have audio of Greg Williams saying to go after Crabtree's ACL, with eyewitness testimony that he was rubbing bills in-between his fingers while saying so.

 

I'm sorry, but Saints fans need to get off this train.

 

The idea that Greg Williams is lying and admitting to something he didn't actually do in order to save his NFL career is ludicrous in the extreme. If he didn't actually do anything, why would his career be in jeopardy in the first place? Because the league wants to make an example out of one organization just so they can say, "Hey, we told these guys to stop it," when lawsuits for concussions come down the line in a few years even though that organization did *nothing wrong*? What, did they just pull the Saints name out of a hat? Is that really what this guy is espousing as a legitimate theory?

 

Come on, son.

 

The NFL wrote Gregg Williams apology speech for him, as stated on the Dan Patrick show. But it is more about the players than anything else now. Even after Williams idiotic pregame speech the Saints commited NO fouls in that game. Plus the fact that all ESPN and NFL network show are legal hits.

 

I stand by my statements is that there is no evidence justifying the players went with a bounty system. Pay for performance being different (tho considering how our defense performed there is no real evidance of that either).

 

Why won't he let the NFLPA have the evidance?

 

Besides, this conspiracy theory is better than listening to the ones that say Payton and Brees pulled this off themselves to have the chance to go to Dallas next year

[Thanatos 2,847]

The NFL wrote Gregg Williams apology speech for him, as stated on the Dan Patrick show.

 

Williams read the speech. If he had done nothing wrong, why do that? Why not challenge the NFL to release the evidence? He apologized for doing something he didn't do, according to you. In order to save an NFL career that would never be in jeopardy if he didn't actually do anything.

 

But it is more about the players than anything else now. Even after Williams idiotic pregame speech the Saints commited NO fouls in that game. Plus the fact that all ESPN and NFL network show are legal hits.

 

Irrelevant. If I take a gun out and try to kill you, but my aim is horrible and I completely miss with all six shots, I'm still guilty of attempted murder.

 

I stand by my statements is that there is no evidence justifying the players went with a bounty system. Pay for performance being different (tho considering how our defense performed there is no real evidance of that either).

 

Right. The confessions of both Payton and Williams to that fact don't mean anything.

 

Why won't he let the NFLPA have the evidance?

 

I'm assuming he is going to get it to them. It's just not anything important, since they've already pleaded guilty.

 

Besides, this conspiracy theory is better than listening to the ones that say Payton and Brees pulled this off themselves to have the chance to go to Dallas next year

 

 

Wow. Yeah that one is worse.

Edited April 19, 2012 by Thanatos19