Trump Regime thread.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I mean, why is it ok to say anything?

I think that's fair. I just think you should be able to rationalize something if you are going to call it bullshit. People get to believe whatever they want, that's a beautiful thing about this country. And for the most part I think Sean's a good guy, I just think it's not really doing the topic Justice when you're like this is a bunch of crap anyway, it just seems dismissive to me. I mean I could be wrong I'm not ruling that out either.

 

I was just like to point out for the record, I have no problem with any religion in particular, I have no problem with people believing what they want to believe, I think healthy discussion about it is good. It just seems to me when you're so flippantly dismissive of something, it's intellectually lazy. I know Sean is smart, and he can rationalize his own opinions. He's also a grown man so you can believe them as well, however there are several Christians on the board, and I just want to know why it's okay to flippantly dismiss religion, but if I say atheists are retarded for believing what they believe, and how could they do that, there's an irrational double standard there. I think that is more or less the part that I'm trying to address with these statements. Not so much trying to debate religion, or people stances on it.

Edited November 8, 2017 by Omerta

[seanbrock 1,684]

I've read a lot of the Bible I've read some texts from the Veda's and I read a lot of books about religion in jail (Confessions By St. Augustine and I also read about Aquinas in college) and I have a background in history so while I'm not a scriptural scholar, I do know some things about religion. I also know a little about Islam, Bhuddism and Hinduism. I know a lot of religious people, some of them are my friends and some of them are really smart. Hell some of them are smarter than I am.

 

I think the parables in religion and some of the moral guidelines it provides are good. Some of them are actually pretty fucked up though, like some of the old testament of the Bible or how Hinduism basically imposes the caste system on its society. Most people ignore that stuff now but they didn't always and it is still part of that belief system and where it came from. I don't think believing in religion is bad and I don't think less of anyone who does. Religion just doesn't make sense to me. We know for a fact that there are just a lot of flat out lies and contradictions in pretty much all religious texts.

[seanbrock 1,684]

http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/05/hillarys-campaign-accuses-donna-brazile-of-spreading-false-russian-fueled-propaganda/

 

Now Donna Brazile is a Russian spy. If only there was some kind of way to prove that the Russians hacked their servers? Maybe if they didn't destroy them idk

[blotsfan 2,112]

So, about last night...

 

The Dems won bigly. Most notably is in Virginia where the republican candidate for governor ran a total "trumpesque" campaign and trump supported him vocally on twitter, and through a robocall sent out to people the day of the election. He lost by 9 percentage points.

 

Then just to make things funny, Trump tweeted this (yes, I hate 280 characters too, but this is the world we live in).

 

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/928074747316928513

 

 

All over in the state and local governments, the republicans got hit hard. Hopefully a good sign going forward.

Edited November 8, 2017 by blotsfan

[seanbrock 1,684]

I won't declare any kind of victory until I see who their donors are. It would be a fucking travesty if the Dems weren't forced to make any changes and were able to run on being Anti-Trump instead of running on the actual issues. I know the guy who won in Virginia used to be a fucking Goldman Sachs executive. That's not a victory.

[blotsfan 2,112]

I know the guy who won in Virginia used to be a fucking Goldman Sachs executive. That's not a victory.

Not only are your purity tests harmful for the US, I see literally nothing that says this is true. He came from a military background. Unless you mean one of the downballot people, in which case, i haven't checked every winner.

[SteVo+ 3,702]

I'm not sure what would be worse for Republicans: failing to pass this tax bill and infuriating their own base, or passing the tax bill and firing up the Democratic voters even further.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I dont necessarily disagree that the night was a win for Democrats but everyone is using Virginia electing a Democrat governor as the biggest win or proof of that.

 

Virginia has had 5 Republican governors (20 years) in over 150 years and the first one originally ran as a Democrat and was trying to get around their non consecutive terms rule.

 

Anyone who is shocked that Virginia elected a Democrat as governor shouldnt be.

[blotsfan 2,112]

Well before the southern strategy, the parties were basically reversed so that doesn't mean much. Also, it's not so much that the democrat won, it's the huge margin, and the slap in the face it was to the specific trumpian racism gillespie ran on.

[Thanatos 2,847]

 

See in this conversation I don't like saying," Well if you exclude 9/11 than the numbers are in favor of this or that" because how do you exclude that? I mean if we are excluding any that has happened while trump has been in office you are basing it off an extremely small sample size. The insanity of this all is that Trump has not been president for a year yet, so anything that we are going to try to evaluate for his tenure in office, is going to be small when you are talking about a statistical analysis.

 

I dont agree with discriminating against ANYONE.. All I was trying to convey is that when Sean says something like," Domestic terrorism has killed more people than Islamic extremists" unless you frame that with a quantifying or qualifying statement than it is categorically false in our lifetimes.

 

One more thing to mention about excluding 9/11 is that it really is unjust in a full picture. AS an example that we can all relate to, lets call it "The CJ2K" effect. I remember when people were saying he was the best in the league and his detractors saying," Well if it weren't for 2 runs his YPG would suck, or his YPC would suck. Well the fact is you cant do that just to suit your argument. Same with Barry Sanders. People point out he had the most runs for losses than any other back when trying to argue for Peyton or whatever, well that is true, but he also made up for it with huge runs later.

 

I say that to say that yes 9/11 would certainly skew the numbers, but does that mean we get to say we discount it? I guess I dont know what people are trying to say when they say this terrorism v.s. that terrorism. Frame it and then we can go from there.

 

Everything else about it being minuscule either way, and the divisive nature of the media, if we can agree it happens by both "sides" than I will agree with that as well. .

 

It's because it's not recent history any longer. 9/11 was 17 years ago. We've taken steps to hopefully prevent that from happening.

 

I am not saying we can only count attacks since Trump has become president, I'm saying Trump's argument for banning Muslims isn't based on the 9/11 attacks, but on far more recent events, such as the shooting in San Fran last year, or the one in New York a few days ago, while simultaneously ignoring terrorist attacks by non-Muslims and basically not even discussing them except to condemn them when pressed.

 

You get my point? No one is proposing legislation for more gun control from the GOP side of things to try to cut down on the incidents like in LV and Texas. Muslim terrorist attacks account for a miniscule fraction of American deaths per year, and yet any time one happens, banning Muslims from the US comes up as if its some sort of option.

[Thanatos 2,847]

As someone who does know a great deal about Christianity, at least, gonna chime in on the religion front.

 

I have a masters of divinity from a conservative seminary. At one point about seven years ago, my goal in life was to become a pastor. I had my doubts and shit, same as everyone, but I figured going to a conservative seminary there would be people there who could answer my questions.

 

There weren't. What I saw there was a great deal of intelligent people painfully trying to twist Scripture around to marry it with what they knew to be true from evidence. These were very smart people. The vast majority of them, I would say, were also very good and kind people. But they were deluding themselves into believing they could get the two to fit. They wanted the Bible to be 100% accurate and the literal word of God and its just not possible knowing what we know now.

 

A couple of them, I think, recognized the issue, because when I began asking questions, they tried for the longest time to come up with answers, before finally falling back on the "you have to just have faith" response, which is the default response when you don't know how to answer someone.

 

I had an email just last week from my favorite professor there where he tried to lay out a setup to answer my questions regarding evolution and the Bible, but even he acknowledged it just doesn't quite work. Props to him for trying to figure it out though. If anyone can come up with some sort of solution, it'd probably be him, he was always amazing to talk to.

 

Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of things one can read from the Bible and agree with, learn from, and apply to life. This, however, is not a good argument for the positives of religion, IMO, as that statement can A) be applied to any religion, so it doesn't help with one religion vs another and B) also be applied to any great literary work, and even just a simple book of morals. I can get lessons and morals from the Lord of the Rings and Harry Potter and Aesop's Fables and the Grimm Brothers Fairytales.

 

And yes, in all of those books there are also things that are wrong and things that can't be applied in reality. The same is true in the Bible. Taking infants and dashing their heads against rocks is wrong. Yet the Bible blesses people who would do that to certain people. Having a bear eat some young men for making fun of the bald head of Elijah is unjust, yet God made that happen. Selling your daughter into slavery to pay a debt, letting your daughter's rapist marry her, etc. Just for fun: have a whole passage dedicated to how women like the big dicks and huge emissions of foreigners.

 

The Bible is indeed a good book that one can read with a critical gaze and get good life lessons and morals out of, while also discarding those morals that are outdated or just wrong. The same goes for any other literary work.

Edited November 8, 2017 by Thanatos

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Well before the southern strategy, the parties were basically reversed so that doesn't mean much. Also, it's not so much that the democrat won, it's the huge margin, and the slap in the face it was to the specific trumpian racism gillespie ran on.

The southern strategy back in like the 60s 70s?? Maybe Ive got my history confused but the reversal happened a lot earlier than that. As I know it, Democrats switched over around the turn of the century (1900) with William Jennings Bryan, Republicans didnt start taking on opposite stances for a few years after that but definitely before FDR so Id say 30s at the latest.

 

Since 1930, Virginia has had 4 republican governors and the guy who switched to Republican after his first term. So Virginia sects a Republican on average once every 16-20 years.

 

Again, it shouldnt surprise anyone. But I understand your its more about... line.

[seanbrock 1,684]

Well before the southern strategy, the parties were basically reversed so that doesn't mean much. Also, it's not so much that the democrat won, it's the huge margin, and the slap in the face it was to the specific trumpian racism gillespie ran on.

I meant to say the New Jersey guy was a former Goldman Sachs executive but yeah I won't vote for anyone who takes corporate money because that means they've been bought. They don't just give you that money with no strings attatched. Corey Booker took a lot of money for Pharmaceutical companies and he voted against a bill that would have brought down the prices of life saving medication because he was bought.

 

Go ahead and keep lapping up all the bullshit the DNC feeds you and vote for all their hand picked candidates if you don't want anything to change ever. The DNC has literally stated that what you want doesn't matter. When they get caught lying and cheating their own fucking constituents they just tell you to STFU, move on and unite....behind their bullshit corporatism. If that's what you support and that what you want your government to reflect then by all means just keep voting for more of the same.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Regarding the religion conversation btw -- not everything on this planet or outside of it needs a concrete explanation in my opinion. I understand there are people and minds on this Earth that are more "logical" or "practical" and they need "facts" for everything they see or come across. There is nothing wrong, inherently anyway with that.

 

Faith is exactly that... Faith. It isn't science.

 

Different circumstances, but I went through a similar period that Thanatos did in regards to questioning religion. I've told this story before, so I will keep it short. But I grew up in a relatively strong Catholic household. I became a religious education teacher at 16 but some of the questions 2nd graders ask can be tough and after a while made me start questioning my own faith and beliefs. Went to people who were smarter than me in the church, and my questions couldn't get answered -- not in a way I wanted at the time and certainly not in a scientific "here is the proof" kind of way. For a long time I was angry about this, felt jipped and lied to.. I stopped teaching, stopped going to church. This is years later, but eventually and I don't know what it was specifically... But I got to a point of self-discovery where my belief and faith was restored. I still hate most organized religion, seems kinda scammish to me.

 

But the foundation of religion, faith, got me. I believe... In something. I don't know what exactly, but something. A lot of that goes back to some of Ngata's posts regarding just not knowing or being unable to prove something one way or another. There are mysteries like that in life and perhaps beyond.

 

One example that comes to my mind is life after death or really just after death... period. What scientific proof is there that there is something beyond our physical realm? To my knowledge, not really any. But for reasons I can't really explain other than some personal experiences, I fully believe in something. It might sound crazy, but I've gone to and / or sat in with "psychics" , mediums, clairvoyants. Shit can get really eerie. Talking to dead people isn't as ridiculous as it probably sounds. And I am not speaking of these phony people giving you these generalities trying to pigeon hole you into answers or confirmations. I am talking people reading, feeling, and conveying energy from sources science doesn't / can't quantify.

 

This planet and everything on it is full of energy, some of which is power beyond human understanding -- and I truly believe that to be fact. And if I believe that to be true, some of these religions or their beliefs aren't really that far of a stretch away.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Olenna4Ever

[blotsfan 2,112]

I meant to say the New Jersey guy was a former Goldman Sachs executive but yeah I won't vote for anyone who takes corporate money because that means they've been bought. They don't just give you that money with no strings attatched. Corey Booker took a lot of money for Pharmaceutical companies and he voted against a bill that would have brought down the prices of life saving medication because he was bought.

 

Go ahead and keep lapping up all the bullshit the DNC feeds you and vote for all their hand picked candidates if you don't want anything to change ever. The DNC has literally stated that what you want doesn't matter. When they get caught lying and cheating their own fucking constituents they just tell you to STFU, move on and unite....behind their bullshit corporatism. If that's what you support and that what you want your government to reflect then by all means just keep voting for more of the same.

 

Oh ok I just looked at the New Jersey guy. Looks like 3/4ths of his campaign was self-funded, he supports a $15 minimum wage, legalization of weed, and single-payer. Seems much more progressive than the centrist democrat establishment.

[seanbrock 1,684]

If he was employed by the financial industry I just simply do not trust him. Especially for Goldman Sachs. If turns out to be great then I'm happy to be wrong but until he proves otherwise in my eyes he is a liar and a thief just like the rest.

[Thanatos 2,847]

No psychic or medium, to my knowledge, has ever been able to show under controlled circumstances that they actually have some sort of supernatural connection. There is still a standing 1 million dollar reward for anyone who can prove they can contact the dead, actually use magic, or do anything outside the natural order, basically.

 

They can only do it in their own little section, controlled by them. Why? Because it's a scam and they are using completely regular means to scam people. It's nothing more than an elaborate magic trick.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Thanatos

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

No psychic or medium, to my knowledge, has ever been able to show under controlled circumstances that they actually have some sort of supernatural connection. There is still a standing 1 million dollar reward for anyone who can prove they can contact the dead, actually use magic, or do anything outside the natural order, basically.

 

They can only do it in their own little section, controlled by them. Why? Because it's a scam and they are using completely regular means to scam people. It's nothing more than an elaborate magic trick.

 

How do they do it?

[blotsfan 2,112]

How do they do it?

Do what?

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Im asking Thantos to explain their process because I have personal experiences that would refute anything you find on google.

 

Not to say there arent hacks or phoneys tho.

[blotsfan 2,112]

Oh. I thought you meant "how do the psychics do it."

 

James Randi is the guy with the million dollar reward. Here's some info.

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Million_Dollar_Paranormal_Challenge

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

There have been studies done that show there are mediums who can retrieve specific information about deceased people with no prior knowledge of them or the living person trying to contact the deceased.

 

How does that happen?

[blotsfan 2,112]

There have been studies done that show there are mediums who can retrieve specific information about deceased people with no prior knowledge of them or the living person trying to contact the deceased.

Like...?

Edited November 9, 2017 by blotsfan

[blotsfan 2,112]

Oh bee tee dubs, republican nominee for senator roy moore has been accused of sexual assault of a minor. I know its unlikely to matter given that its alabama, but hey.

[Thanatos 2,847]

There have been studies done that show there are mediums who can retrieve specific information about deceased people with no prior knowledge of them or the living person trying to contact the deceased.

 

How does that happen?

 

I have never seen any actual scientific study that has come to that conclusion. There has been exactly zero evidence in a controlled environment with no variables where a medium can contact the dead- again, to my knowledge. Feel free to link such an experiment. It would be fascinating to me.

 

I'm not saying I know how they all do it, I would wager they have different means.

 

One man, for example, was a pastor who claimed he could use God to talk to people's souls. People would come from all around that area to hear him.

 

What was going on was about 3-4 weeks prior to his speech, he would send men and women into the churches in that area as visitors. They would act like normal people just wanting to get to know the congregation, because they just moved here, etc. They would take down a list of all prayer requests anytime someone asked in the service. And since people always ask for prayer for support after a family death, he had all the information he required to make it seem like he was talking to their loved ones.

 

Another televangelist was more simplistic, people would actually submit prayer requests at the door when they walked in and he would act like he had no prior knowledge of it, but was being fed the info in a hidden earpiece

 

Another medium simply had someone in the backroom look up people on social media using their name and their face, which was being captured by a hidden camera. He wouldn't ask for their name, but he would ask for payment up front, and if people tried to pay cash, he would refuse it. He was looking for the card with their details on it, of course, but in the heat of the moment, most people wouldn't think about that.

 

Another had an old chinese trick with mirrors and smoke so he actually conjured something that looked vaguely like the person they describe- the Illusionist's protagonist uses this trick.

 

It's really much easier to convince people when they want to be convinced. We want to have that last conversation with someone who passed too soon, or tell our dead relatives we love them one more time. Most of the time, people slip, and give the medium something by which they can at least make a vague stab at a relative's name or something of the sort.

 

It's really no different than the people who tried to scam my grandma last week. They called her pretending to be me. All they said was "Grandma?" And she thought it was kinda like my voice, so she replied back with my name, and that's all they needed to try to convince her I was about to go to jail and needed her to pay bail, and please don't tell my parents because they'd be upset.

 

I'm not closeminded on the issue, I'd love to hear your experience, but I will say that oftentimes, our memory of an event that we want to be true becomes skewed in such a way as to make it more believable that it is true.

Edited November 10, 2017 by Thanatos