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seanbrock

2020 Democratic Primary Race

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The Assad thing is a problem. Not because we shouldn't be willing to talk with dictators, but because Tulsi had no business doing that on her own accord. 

Love the attacks claiming she is sponsored by Russia, though. For what purpose here, guys? Tulsi would kick Trump's ass six ways from Sunday and if the Russians cant see that they are dumb as shit. Not everyone on the Dem side is some sort of angel that has no issues. They act like anyone pointing out any sort of weakness in the Dem candidates is sponsored by Russia lol. You really think Trump isn't going to use these same attacks? Better to have it out now so they can come up with some sort of defense, though I don't know what kind of defense there is when you put thousands of people in jail for smoking weed and then laugh about using it yourself, or hiding evidence that would have got a man off of death row.

I don't remember where I had Harris placed as far as candidates that can beat Trump, but Tulsi just sunk her campaign. Unless that whole thing was a flat out lie, (and it wasn't), she has no shot in hell now, the Dems better not nominate her.

Edited by Thanatos

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The conceit is basically not to get Gabbard to win (she won't), it's to get Biden or Warren on the ballot so Trump can beat them. Russia fears Harris and what she can do and would rather have a weak president in charge of America.

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Yeah, I mean the nomination is still a long shot for Tulsi... but she helped Biden a lot and gave herself some name recognition. She’s put herself in a good position to be a cabinet member or potential V.P. (unless Harris still wins obv)

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@RazorStarSo how is Trump a Russian puppet? He's been actively trying to overthrow the government of one of his allies in Venezuela. He's trying to use NATO funding to block an energy deal that would fuck Russia's economy if they don't get it. He's been escalating with Iran, he's bombed Syria. What has Russia gotten out of a Trump presidency? He's not tearing apart the country anymore than Bush did and all these undemocratic, dictatorial moves were made possible by the extreme power grab of the executive branch the past two presidential elects. Trump is your standard psychopathic right winger that's trying to destroy the planet and steal as much money as possible on their way out the door. He's just dumber and more brash. 

If you want to tell me that Trump is is the pocket of AIPAC and the Saudi Royal Family, I think there's a lot more evidence of that. Beyond that we have corporations spending billions of dollars on elections all over the country. 

 

 

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He doesn't need to be a puppet to serve the interest of the russian government. Keep your enemies unstable while you're dealing with your own instability. 

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5 hours ago, DalaiLama4Ever said:

Yeah, I mean the nomination is still a long shot for Tulsi... but she helped Biden a lot and gave herself some name recognition. She’s put herself in a good position to be a cabinet member or potential V.P. (unless Harris still wins obv)

I would vot for trump if the DNC picks Kamala over Tulsi.

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Tulsi just qualified for the debates in September. I have been throwing her $500 here and there trying not to max out to early. That said if you donate even $5 you count towards her 130,000 unique donor goal. She made that but is trying to hit 150,000.

 

She raised more today than any other previous day.

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11 hours ago, RazorStar said:

He doesn't need to be a puppet to serve the interest of the russian government. Keep your enemies unstable while you're dealing with your own instability. 

Well the US also backed out of the INF treaty. Do you think Putin wants Bolton and Trump with their finger on the bottom?  Idk man, some how I highly doubt that.

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On 7/31/2019 at 1:06 AM, seanbrock said:

@Thanatossaid somewhere either in a thread or the shoutbox to me when I doubted the polling and I said that the DNC is scrambling to find someone that can legitimately challenge Sanders that I was a conspiracy theorist or whatever but look at that debate. Almost the entire debate was "do you agree with Bernie Sanders?" The entire primary is essentially just based on all of HIS policies and candidates are either flat out running against his agenda (Delaney, Hickenlooper etc) or trying to co-opt it & water it down(see Kamala Harris' med4all/student debt platform). We're talking about a guy that had a town hall on Fox News, was blatantly attacked by the moderators and received an ovation....ON FOX NEWS lol. He's blatantly attacked by CNN and MSNBC too and still he has more money, more donors and more volunteers than any other candidate by far save for maybe Trump who might have more money but I highly doubt he has more donors.

I'll say it again, all these polls that have Biden in the lead are to make it seem like the DNC didn't cheat Bernie again. 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/08/02/us/politics/2020-democratic-fundraising.html

Again, any poll that doesn't have Bernie in front is not legitimate.

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14 hours ago, Omerta said:

Tulsi just qualified for the debates in September. I have been throwing her $500 here and there trying not to max out to early. That said if you donate even $5 you count towards her 130,000 unique donor goal. She made that but is trying to hit 150,000.

 

She raised more today than any other previous day.

This is awesome. I was really worried she wouldn't hit the donor or polling thresholds. 

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On 8/2/2019 at 1:24 PM, RazorStar said:

The conceit is basically not to get Gabbard to win (she won't), it's to get Biden or Warren on the ballot so Trump can beat them. Russia fears Harris and what she can do and would rather have a weak president in charge of America.

And Harris won't get beat? 

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I think it's far less likely, but we're talking about 1 percent to zero here.

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On 8/2/2019 at 10:47 PM, Omerta said:

Tulsi just qualified for the debates in September. I have been throwing her $500 here and there trying not to max out to early. That said if you donate even $5 you count towards her 130,000 unique donor goal. She made that but is trying to hit 150,000.

 

She raised more today than any other previous day.

She hit the fundraising part, I think she still needs the polling ones.

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8 hours ago, Thanatos said:

She hit the fundraising part, I think she still needs the polling ones.

This is correct. 

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1 hour ago, Omerta said:

This is correct. 

Honestly if they keep Tulsi out because of polling numbers we need to demand transparency on polling. After both debates she was the number 1 searched, she's gotten a lot of donations as a result. She's generates headlines without being given an artificial spotlight like someone like Mayor Pete. She's picked up celebrity endorsements I think based on running a very foreign policy/anti-regime change platform that resonates with a lot of people. I don't think she's up there with Sanders and Warren but I think she's replaced Kamala Harris is the secondary tier of candidates in most people's eyes. Something is up guys. Don't trust the polls 

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That is what I am saying. I think idea for idea she absolutely murders every candidate in the field including St. Bernie and Warren. She is the only one who is stating facts on the stage. Actual facts, not Kamala Harris ones.

I will take your route with the democratic party. Until they stop being a corrupt morally bankrupt pile of shit I will vote for the most far right douchebag that the Democrats hate the most. This time it will be trump next time I'm praying its Santorum because if he bans porn there might be enough of an uprising to where the Democrats stop being mindless identitarian douchebags. I fucking LOATHE the Democratic party 

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She isn't the ONLY one, but facts get you to poll at 1-2% typically ha. People don't like hearing facts (at least, that's what they tell us). I think that's more the media thinking everyone is stupid.

I don't want to hear a senseless idealogue attack someone else based on vague ideologies and identity politics, " You're a socialist ", " You're just listing off GOP talking point", etc etc... What I do want to hear are those facts. Tell me not only what you want to do but how you are going to do it. It's why Bernie fumbles every single time they ask him how he is paying for his programs... It's easy to sit up there and scream " free Healthcare, free college, guaranteed jobs for everyone " etc... That's (mostly) easy stuff to blindly believe in. But you start losing people when you tell them to achieve those your plan calls for the decimation of the middle class. 

That's where you pique my interest. I want to hear those facts, facts about your opponents record that are shady. Separate yourself but do it the right way and that's what Tulsi is doing. I like it because on twitter for example... every post Kamala has made since the debate are people questioning her record now -- and they should. She still hasn't been able to defend it. I am sure she will be better prepared next time.

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1 hour ago, DalaiLama4Ever said:

She isn't the ONLY one, but facts get you to poll at 1-2% typically ha. People don't like hearing facts (at least, that's what they tell us). I think that's more the media thinking everyone is stupid.

I don't want to hear a senseless idealogue attack someone else based on vague ideologies and identity politics, " You're a socialist ", " You're just listing off GOP talking point", etc etc... What I do want to hear are those facts. Tell me not only what you want to do but how you are going to do it. It's why Bernie fumbles every single time they ask him how he is paying for his programs... It's easy to sit up there and scream " free Healthcare, free college, guaranteed jobs for everyone " etc... That's (mostly) easy stuff to blindly believe in. But you start losing people when you tell them to achieve those your plan calls for the decimation of the middle class. 

That's where you pique my interest. I want to hear those facts, facts about your opponents record that are shady. Separate yourself but do it the right way and that's what Tulsi is doing. I like it because on twitter for example... every post Kamala has made since the debate are people questioning her record now -- and they should. She still hasn't been able to defend it. I am sure she will be better prepared next time.

 I agree. Especially about Bernie. Him and his followers are so fucking unrealistic it boggles the mind.

The brilliance if that move by Tulsi isbyou cant defend it and if you do you look worse. Kamala is sunk for the person if average intelligence. You will always have your SJW chode who says," you dont like her because she is a black woman." That said, minority privelege can only carry a person so far.

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I'm not sure if yall haven't read Bernie's actual plan or what, but he has laid out exactly how he's going to pay for everything. You can say you don't want it to happen because of increased taxes, but arguing that it will decimate the middle class is hyperbole. Every other civilized country in the world has a less expensive healthcare system than the US, we have plenty of money to make Medicare for All happen. Yes you're gonna pay more taxes, but if you get a medical emergency you won't go bankrupt or have to hope your insurance will cover it and not try to fuck you over as 95% of them do. 

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2 minutes ago, Thanatos said:

I'm not sure if yall haven't read Bernie's actual plan or what, but he has laid out exactly how he's going to pay for everything. You can say you don't want it to happen because of increased taxes, but arguing that it will decimate the middle class is hyperbole. Every other civilized country in the world has a less expensive healthcare system than the US, we have plenty of money to make Medicare for All happen. Yes you're gonna pay more taxes, but if you get a medical emergency you won't go bankrupt or have to hope your insurance will cover it and not try to fuck you over as 95% of them do. 

Saying 95% of medical emergencies bankrupt you is hyperbole. Also there is a reason we have the best medical resources and technology in the world.

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32 minutes ago, Thanatos said:

I'm not sure if yall haven't read Bernie's actual plan or what, but he has laid out exactly how he's going to pay for everything. You can say you don't want it to happen because of increased taxes, but arguing that it will decimate the middle class is hyperbole. Every other civilized country in the world has a less expensive healthcare system than the US, we have plenty of money to make Medicare for All happen. Yes you're gonna pay more taxes, but if you get a medical emergency you won't go bankrupt or have to hope your insurance will cover it and not try to fuck you over as 95% of them do. 

How many people face medical emergencies compared to those who don't? Modernhealthcare.com says there are 43 M people with unpaid medical bills out there, there are roughly 150M in the American middle class. That's not a great trade off.  I posted other statistics a few pages ago in a discussion with Sean that you can go back and read if you want to. And idk what plan you read, but the last version I read, he doesn't lay out what how he covers the cost AT ALL. He has a huge PDF document on his website with OPTIONS to pay for it... Not how he will pay for it, but how he MIGHT pay for it. i will read any literature you have that is newer than his website PDF though ( https://www.sanders.senate.gov/download/options-to-finance-medicare-for-all?inline=file ) 

Highlights Include:
It DOES hurt the middle class, especially when you talk about abolishing private health insurance -- which takes away insurance from 150M people or so. 4% tax tacked right onto employees... 7.5 to the employer which you are CRAZY to think that employees aren't going to end up paying for.... 11.5% more of my check is going to be stolen from me? Fuck that noise. Find a better way. He has other options listed there, these taxes should not be seen as viable. Is "devastate" hyperbole? Maybe, I am not going to argue semantics with you. But this hurts middle class families A LOT. The middle class has already shrunk by 10+% in the last 50 years -- Bernie wouldn't help that.

Bernie (and Sean) of course argued that middle class families, even though being taxed out the ass, will actually save money somehow. Multiple sources, including politifact, have already debunked those claims. The studies Bernie uses as his argument are outdated and extremely misleading (according to politifact, not me). His claims that families will save money have been rated as "mostly false".

To help pay for this plan, Bernie is expecting hospitals to charge approximately half of their current rates. Hospital prices ARE insane, I agree, but... we pass this bill and we're expecting hospitals to just half their rates? Really? Good luck. 

Edited by DalaiLama4Ever

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Not to mention the stats on medical bankruptcies the far left uses were written by warren and have been ABSOLUTELY SHREDDED because she did horrid, dog shit research. She called a bankruptcy any time someone missed work or had more than 1000 in medical debt ON TOP OF THAT She tacked that to the whole household so now instead of using her shitty criteria to say one person is bankrupt she can say the 6 year old that lives with them as well. Dishonest cunt.

And I can tell you through my wife who is a surgeon they are not taking pay cuts. Why would they? They spent more than a decade and two for some acquiring almost or in the millions for a medical doctorate. They won't allow it. Wait until people go to hospitals and no doctor will work for half their salary. Tulsi is one of the few candidates who has plans for the economy that dont include" RAISE ALL THE TAXES AND GIVE AWAY ALL THE THINGS." To try to sway the stupid, entitled millenial.

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Tulsi Gabbard supports medicare for all guys... In fact she supports Sanders' medicare for all bill. Actually, Tulsi Gabbard is Bernie Sanders biggest supporter. She fought for him when he wouldn't even fight for himself. A lot of the things Sanders is preaching, Tulsi is going to bring to Washington. 

Honestly, this is speculation but I'm not even sure Tulsi would challenge Sanders if he hadn't bent the knee to the DNC and the Clinton's.

Edited by seanbrock
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1 hour ago, Omerta said:

Saying 95% of medical emergencies bankrupt you is hyperbole. Also there is a reason we have the best medical resources and technology in the world.

You're misreading me here. I'm saying 95% of insurance companies try to fuck you over- as in try to figure out a way not to pay for your medical bill, whatever that might be.

It's not because we pay like 1000% more for it. Those prices are literally made up by the hospitals and the insurance companies. And even if your statement is true (it's not), is it worth it to pay ridiculously jacked up prices for medical care that is just slightly better? (As a general rule here.) For example, just ask Sarge how much his back surgery cost him in Columbia versus what it would have cost him in the US- and why.

When we talk about halving costs- its the ridiculous costs that we charge the consumer, which are mainly made up bullshit from the hospital. $60 for a single tylenol pill. $10k for a night's stay, etc. This is a problem between the insurance company and the hospital management- it is NOT the doctors fault. As far as the doctors opinions themselves they are split right down the middle: 49% for, 51% against from the latest poll I see, (May 2019).

And hate to burst yall's bubble here, but just so you know, Tulsi supports Medicare for all as well. (Also a $15/hr federal minimum wage.)

 

Edited by Thanatos
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2 minutes ago, Thanatos said:

You're misreading me here. I'm saying 95% of insurance companies try to fuck you over- as in try to figure out a way not to pay for your medical bill, whatever that might be.

It's not because we pay like 1000% more for it. Those prices are literally made up by the hospitals and the insurance companies. And even if your statement is true (it's not), is it worth it to pay ridiculously jacked up prices for medical care that is just slightly better? (As a general rule here.) For example, just ask Sarge how much his back surgery cost him in Columbia versus what it would have cost him in the US- and why.

It is absolutely true. Even as recently as a week ago we proved with the first ever CRISPR treatment anywhere in the world and the boost else is close.

Slightly better is relative. If US doctors and research labs cure sickle cell is that a slight thing. I had a broken neck and my share was less than 3k. My son broke is collarbone 6 months ago. It costs nothing.  Preventive care for mmt wise is 0. Maybe it is cheaper is in Colombia,  but I would take the innovative technology in the US versus anywhere else. 

And I would say it is more important as well because what I'd it's your kid.  You pay anything.  So put me in the place he has access to that. 

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