Junior Seau Dead at 43

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Perhaps he wasn't left with much of a choice, perhaps his brain damage was leading him to it? After countless concussions, you can't expect your reasoning faculties to be on the same level as someone with a healthy brain does. I know his brain injuries aren't the only reason he's depressed, but they're a benefactor to the reason why he would consider suicide his only option.

 

Ok really are we going to use that excuse...it was the concussions. Lets look at high profile athletes who were probably more screwed up than him and have learned to cope.

 

Muhammad Ali, Chuck Liddel, Leon Spinks, Jake Lamotta, Ken Shamkrock, Jack Johnson, Pernell Whittaker, Randy Couture, Shane Mosley, Bernard Hopkins, Ray Mancini, Matt hughes, Deacon Jones, Jim Brown, Marion Motley, Earl Campbell, Lorenzo Neal, London Fletcher, Ray Lewis, Joe Frazier, and this list goes on and on and on. They have managed it cant be just concussed or hits because seriously all these guys took a bigger pounding.

[RazorStar 4,025]

So everyone lives the same life, and goes through the same experiences, experiences everything the same, and has the same problems. It doesn't work like that. Some people just react differently to different things. It's just not right to condemn a dead man, regardless of the circumstances that led to his death.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Yes circumstances maybe and they do very but the whole concussion thing is BS, their are literally thousands of athletes who have lived perfectly acceptable lives after sports who had more concussions than Seau.

 

So it goes back to what I said, when you have kids man up and fix your problems. The End. I did not condemn him, apparently he did that himself. If the man no longer feels his life is no longer worth living and by all accounts should be a big advocate for his own life, people want me to feel sorry.

 

No all my condolences go to his children, not the man who thought his kids were no longer worth living for. :confused:

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I'm pretty sure there has at least been a correlation shown that former football players suffer depression at a higher rate than most people (I don't have time/don't feel like looking it up, but I'm sure the research is still on going) but from the commentary I've seen it doesn't seem like he was showing any signs of depression, I can understand that depression and other circumstances can make someone feel like suicide is their only option, what I don't understand is why they don't reach out for help, it seems like he was in constant contact with his mother, yet she was shocked by the suicide, that's what I can't wrap my head around

 

The problem with depression and other head injuries / trauma is that it's going to effect everyone differently.

 

Sure you can find patterns, but you'd be pressed to find any two cases that are identical. It is going to effect everyone differently and everyone is going to have their own ways to manage or cope (or not) with it.

 

There are (probably) thousands upon thousands of former players living with high levels of brain / head trauma. And even though one suicide is too many, it's still a rather small fraction of those thousands that resort to this kind of solution.

 

Numerous people want to hate on Goodell for his work since becoming the Commish and rant about him "pussifying" the league... but then something like this happens and you say to yourself. Hey... Maybe Roger and the NFL know what they are doing.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Hey... Maybe Roger and the NFL know what they are doing.

 

I will never say that but I understand the premise.

[sweetness34 142]

As someone who has studied a lot on concussions because I've suffered them myself, I can tell you even a few can change someone's brain chemistry. And as a psychology major I've done my fair share studying depression.

 

But I've also suffered from depression, and it's no joke. Unless you've suffered from depression, you would not understand. It tore my life apart and made me distance myself from all of my friends and family. Countless times I sat on this cliff outside of town and contemplated jumping off. If you have depression you want nothing more than to escape. If it wouldn't have been for my dad identifying it and making me see a therapist I don't think I'd be alive today. And it can affect anyone, I had a great life.

 

Dopamine is a chemical in charge of happiness, depressed people have less dopamine in their brains. And brain injuries can reduce dopamine transporters in the brain. So if you take a person who maybe already is susceptible to depression, there is a much better chance of a severe depression with repeated brain trauma.

 

So yes he had lots of falling outs, but those may have come after the depression, not be the cause. Depressions changes the person and often ruins close relationships.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

 

Dopamine is a chemical in charge of happiness, depressed people have less dopamine in their brains. And brain injuries can reduce dopamine transporters in the brain. So if you take a person who maybe already is susceptible to depression, there is a much better chance of a severe depression with repeated brain trauma.

 

 

That is a SEVERE understatement and doesn't really give an accurate perception of neurotransmitters or dopamine. All of the neurotransmitters hold a different purpose relaying messages to the brain, and more times than not mild depression is linked to low seratonin levels. Which is exactly why a lot of anti-depressants target seratonin levels.

 

EDIT: I am not saying low dopamine levels can't translate to symptoms of depression, as it is a very diverse thing... But you typically relate it to feelings of satisfaction and motor control, while seratonin is generally what is related to overall or general "happiness"

Edited May 3, 2012 by Favre4Ever

[sweetness34 142]

That is a SEVERE understatement and doesn't really give an accurate perception of neurotransmitters or dopamine. All of the neurotransmitters hold a different purpose relaying messages to the brain, and more times than not mild depression is linked to low seratonin levels. Which is exactly why a lot of anti-depressants target seratonin levels.

Yes it does, but there are a lot studies that link dopamine as well. Obviously I don't want to give a lecture on neurotransmitters. But just look up head traumas and depression, a lot of studies link the two. That is what I'm getting at.

[Shotgun 442]

I don't think a selfish man shoots himself in the chest just so his brain can be studied. No one here knows what the guy was going through and I'd bet no one knows what it's like to be so depressed you go through with killing (or attempting to kill) yourself. I'm sure the guy most likely loved his kids dearly, no one kills themselves like this without some mental issues few can imagine dealing with.

[NaTaS+ 958]

I've had 5 concussions in my life and it's scares me to think that something like this lies in my future. I've never been depressed but who knows as the brain deteriorates what might happen.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I don't think a selfish man shoots himself in the chest just so his brain can be studied. No one here knows what the guy was going through and I'd bet no one knows what it's like to be so depressed you go through with killing (or attempting to kill) yourself. I'm sure the guy most likely loved his kids dearly, no one kills themselves like this without some mental issues few can imagine dealing with.

 

I find it slightly ironic that you claim that none of us know what he went through that caused him to do this... Yet you continue to make judgments on the rest of us, saying none of us have gone through extremely low places in our lives. We don't know him enough to make such statements, but apparently you know us well enough to do the same.

 

Slightly off-topic but that story about him beating his wife (allegedly), getting arrested, and then driving off a cliff kinda makes sense now.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

God what the hell is up with all this sympathy for a guy who committed suicide and left behind children.

 

This man got paid to playt a game for a living and instead of investing his money like a smart man he tries to reinvent the damn wheel and loses his ass. Is it unfortunate ? Sure. Could he have invested it and lived VERY comfortable for the rest of his life ? Yep.

 

Sorry if I dont buy the concussion thing, but I have been hit by more IED's than I care to count and have at least 3 concussions linked to explosive trauma, and several others from whatever asinine field problem I have had to do for the military. Some have coming from jumping out of plains and then smacking your head on a rock or something on a PLF. The concussion things are bullshit there are far more accountants who have suicides and depression than athletes. So by some of you guys logic numbers are a cause of depression. That is a completely bogus and irrelevant argument. Not only have people who have played contact sports and had far more concussions that JR and are perfectly fine way more than they are not.

 

Ok no too people have the same life experiences, how is it soldiers who come back from Iraq and Afghanistan can have their legs blown off and are happy with prosthesis that allow them to live normal lives. So excuse the hell out of me for having no pity for a guy who had a career most would love to have, more money than any of us are likely to see, and the adoration of millions. CAnt do it. This is one big fuckin pity party for a man who took a cowards way and left his kids to fin for themselves. No pity from me. Call me an asshole if you want but this whole lets make some excuse for him shit is getting fuckin old.

Edited May 3, 2012 by Ngata_Chance

[Thanatos 2,847]

Just as it's selfish for someone to take their own life, it's selfish for other people to demand that person stay alive when they are suffering. It's unfair to all parties, but that's besides the point. When their study is completed and the examine his brain, they will no doubt find the damage to his brain would easily cause him to commit suicide. I can't say I'm an expert on the brain, but it's hard to understand what exactly Junior Seau was going through. That's why I can't condemn him for going through with killing himself, when millions of other people in North America have considered doing it themselves.

 

I vehemently disagree with that statement.

 

No one should ever take their own life, period. It's not selfish at all for loved ones to want a person to stay alive, and it is completely selfish for a guy to kill himself and leave his loved ones behind rather than seek medical help, which to the best of my knowledge, he did not.

 

Nor can one say that the damage to the brain would "cause him to commit suicide." That's a guess. We can say that he may have more likely, but he still chose to do this.

 

It's a horrible situation, and I feel extremely sad for his family, but Junior's last act in this life was undoubtedly a selfish one. I don't generally like speaking ill of the dead, but most people seem to be overlooking this.

Edited May 4, 2012 by Thanatos19

[BwareDWare94 723]

I vehemently disagree with that statement.

 

No one should ever take their own life, period. It's not selfish at all for loved ones to want a person to stay alive, and it is completely selfish for a guy to kill himself and leave his loved ones behind rather than seek medical help, which to the best of my knowledge, he did not.

 

Nor can one say that the damage to the brain would "cause him to commit suicide." That's a guess. We can say that he may have more likely, but he still chose to do this.

 

It's a horrible situation, and I feel extremely sad for his family, but Junior's last act in this life was undoubtedly a selfish one. I don't generally like speaking ill of the dead, but most people seem to be overlooking this.

 

I respect the hell out of the fact that you stand on "moral" side of the fence. You're steadfast and knowledgeable--beyond most people who think the things you do. With this, though, I have to call you out. Suicide isn't contemplated for years and then finally followed through with, it follows a horrendous tailspin of helplessness and, just like every killer we pardon for "temporary insanity," we have to assume that suicide doesn't follow a conscious decision as much as an uncontrollable urge. I'm sorry, but you can't just go and ask people who've commit suicide why they did it or what exactly happened. It is not selfish. It is uncontrolled and most people who openly seek help are more often than not just looking for attention. How many people have told you about dealing with depression for years and you knew nothing about it? Probably plenty, but the folks who call you crying on the phone--they don't know a thing about real depression. I don't suffer from it, personally, but it's run in my family and I've seen it and I know that people can't deal with it without somebody reaching out and offering help. It just doesn't happen, man. You have to back off on this one.

[Shotgun 442]

I find it slightly ironic that you claim that none of us know what he went through that caused him to do this... Yet you continue to make judgments on the rest of us, saying none of us have gone through extremely low places in our lives. We don't know him enough to make such statements, but apparently you know us well enough to do the same.

 

 

I continue to judge you? And here I thought I was responding to people judging Seau, but I guess I'm the one judging everyone else, huh?

 

 

I'd bet no one knows what it's like to be so depressed you go through with killing (or attempting to kill) yourself.

 

 

Oh that's right I didn't say anything matter-of-factly, I just assumed since you're all still alive you don't really know what it's like to get to the point you actually kill yourself. Excuse me for making such a ridiculous assumption.

 

[Thanatos 2,847]

I respect the hell out of the fact that you stand on "moral" side of the fence. You're steadfast and knowledgeable--beyond most people who think the things you do. With this, though, I have to call you out. Suicide isn't contemplated for years and then finally followed through with, it follows a horrendous tailspin of helplessness and, just like every killer we pardon for "temporary insanity," we have to assume that suicide doesn't follow a conscious decision as much as an uncontrollable urge. I'm sorry, but you can't just go and ask people who've commit suicide why they did it or what exactly happened. It is not selfish. It is uncontrolled and most people who openly seek help are more often than not just looking for attention. How many people have told you about dealing with depression for years and you knew nothing about it? Probably plenty, but the folks who call you crying on the phone--they don't know a thing about real depression. I don't suffer from it, personally, but it's run in my family and I've seen it and I know that people can't deal with it without somebody reaching out and offering help. It just doesn't happen, man. You have to back off on this one.

 

Hmmm.

 

So you would say that everyone, or at least most people, who commit suicide is doing so, kinda against their will? That they have a mental disorder that is so pronounced that they are actually not responsible for their action?

 

It just seems to me, that given what we know of the matter- which admittedly, is not much- but the fact that he intentionally refrained from damaging his brain so that it could be studied, is the thought process of a logical person in control of their actions. He thought through the action, and its possible consequences, and decided, (nobly), to leave his brain intact so that perhaps others might be saved through its study.

 

I am not saying that it was a consciously selfish motive that caused him to commit suicide. I wouldn't even say that he at all thought he was being selfish, it's just the action itself that strikes me as such- but this is only if he was in control of his action. If he wasn't, then of course it couldn't be selfish.

[BwareDWare94 723]

Hmmm.

 

So you would say that everyone, or at least most people, who commit suicide is doing so, kinda against their will? That they have a mental disorder that is so pronounced that they are actually not responsible for their action?

 

It just seems to me, that given what we know of the matter- which admittedly, is not much- but the fact that he intentionally refrained from damaging his brain so that it could be studied, is the thought process of a logical person in control of their actions. He thought through the action, and its possible consequences, and decided, (nobly), to leave his brain intact so that perhaps others might be saved through its study.

 

I am not saying that it was a consciously selfish motive that caused him to commit suicide. I wouldn't even say that he at all thought he was being selfish, it's just the action itself that strikes me as such- but this is only if he was in control of his action. If he wasn't, then of course it couldn't be selfish.

 

I don't personally think that you are in control of the situation if you take you life, even if it seems so in your own mind. Driving oneself to do such a thing, it would take so much out of you. Even if it seemed like he could make his own decisions, I firmly believe that something ain't right up in there. Something else is the real driving force. Depression is fucked up, man.

[SteelersNation36 128]

So let me get this straight Bware, the ones who have depression but seek help they dont really have "real" depression. They just wanted the attention?

[BwareDWare94 723]

So let me get this straight Bware, the ones who have depression but seek help they dont really have "real" depression. They just wanted the attention?

 

seeking help with real depression is different, because you contact family or trusted friends who don't say a thing to other people and help you set up counseling trips, medical examinations, etc.

 

Them people who call all their friends crying and whining--that's fake as shit.

Edited May 5, 2012 by BwareDWare94

[RazorStar 4,025]

I wouldn't call that fake, I just wouldn't call it depression. It's a natural low in life. Like when someone breaks up with you, you're gonna feel bummed about it for a while, but you get over it. When you can't get over it, and other things happen that build up, and you can't get over those things, that's depression. At least from my understanding of it.

[BLUE 1,026]

Posted by Mike Florio on May 15, 2012, 10:34 PM EDT

 

Here’s a sad and pathetic footnote to the death of linebacker Junior Seau. His house in Oceanside, California was burglarized last week, according to the North County Times.

 

Police say that, on May 7, someone used the dog door to force entry through the garage door, rummaged through cabinets in the garage, and stole a $500 bike that belonged to one of Seau’s friends.

 

Only the garage was entered, not the other areas of the home.

 

Of course, that doesn’t make it any better. Here’s hoping they catch whoever did it, not because of the bike but because of the thought that anyone would enter any portion of Seau’s home in search of things to steal.

 

Source: ProFootballTalk