Razor's Taco Infested Best RB Rankings

[butta54 371]

Look at the games where he has 20+ carries and you'll see he does well when he takes a large chunk of carries. And he's in the top 15 for backs in carries over the past 4 years, and only one of 16 backs with 600 carries over the past 3 seasons, so it's not like he isn't taking a small share of the load. He's consistent when he gets his carries, and he's great when he plays. If your only issue is that he needs more carries then it doesn't matter what you think of him as a back, because he is playing up to that high level consistently.

 

You are aware you are talking about a back who has went over 1000 yards rushing ONE TIME and has never amounted 10 touchdowns rushing and receiving combined? Yeah very high level consistently. Again until he does it FOR FULL CONSECUTIVE SEASONS I'm not entertaining him in the discussion of better than great backs such as Gore or Jackson.

 

500 yards rushing and 4k yards passing. Your argument was that CJ is elite because he's done something that not even ten other people has done. Cam has done something no one in the history of the game has done.And if you think McCoy has had only one good year, I suggest you look at 2010 where he also had 1600+ yards from scrimmage."I watch every nfl team/game." You watch every single game in the entirety of the season, all 256 of them?I'm not comparing it. I'm saying that just because someone broke a NFL record does not make them elite. Just because CJ had a 2,000 yard year doesn't make him elite, just like just because Cam had a 500 yard rushing + 4k yard passing year, something no one else had ever done, doesn't make him elite.And no, the reason why you hadn't watched any Bills game is because of your reasoning. It makes it rather obvious that you don't watch many.I saw CJ play before, he had good blocking and he does good. With poor blocking, he doesn't do good. That's my point. I'm not saying he's bad, but he certainly isn't #2 in the league, (lol). MJD, Rice, McCoy, Arian Foster, AP, and Forte are all better than CJ.

 

Oh the year he barely had over 1000 yards rushing as a running back? And only 8 TDs rushing? Yeah that was such an amazing year for him! :grinno:

 

Yeah the passing part is not that big, the only reason its a record cause you added on a rushing factor for a QB....so what? No one even attempted to make an argument that he is elite and no one would even bring cam into this conversation BUT YOU. He has nothing to do with it and every real football fan knows comparing that to what CJ did is apples and oranges.

 

You can't sit there and say who watches the Bills or Titans just as I can't sit here and tell you that you don't watch CJ enough to tell us he is elite or not. Point is CJ has the tools to run the ball period blocking or not as stated before. You saying all these guys are better after his down season is just ignorant and it is definitely out of line to call some of them elite and Johnson out when he has more skill then most of them. You want to be stuck on what you saw last year from him and think that's what he is, if that is your assumption then you are going to be proven very wrong.

Edited July 12, 2012 by butta55

[RazorStar 4,025]

Oh man a guy who carries the ball so many times has only x amount of volume stats? That is what tends to happen when you have less carries.

[BC 331]

For what it's worth I think James Starks is going to break out this year.

 

bleh

[56AceInDaPlace 110]

 

The stuff about CJ does't need comment since its obvious Mikey takes it balls deep from Chris Johnson.

 

Yeah ok bro, like u havent defended someone on your team u know who is good before.. A Titan fan SHOULD take defense to his player who is elite and doesnt get the credit hes due. I dont think, nor would expect any OTHER fan of a different team to make a case for him. This time im lucky enough to have someone else who ISNT a Titans fan to agree.

 

Ok im confused on one thing, ill throw out the shitty oline blocking statement even though it was shitty. To Thanatos though, if u say I cant use that line argument to why CJ did pretty bad ( not full reason why ), why can u use the argument that when our line was good, CJ does better? If it cant be used to why his play declined from it, how can u use it for when he was doing "well"?

[Thanatos 2,847]

Oh the year he barely had over 1000 yards rushing as a running back? And only 8 TDs rushing? Yeah that was such an amazing year for him! :grinno:

 

Yeah the passing part is not that big, the only reason its a record cause you added on a rushing factor for a QB....so what? No one even attempted to make an argument that he is elite and no one would even bring cam into this conversation BUT YOU. He has nothing to do with it and every real football fan knows comparing that to what CJ did is apples and oranges.

 

You're not getting it at all. Cam isn't elite, I clearly stated that. But again, way to twist my words. You're really good at that. It was the logic that CJ had done something very few others had done, and the implication that that made it obvious he was elite.

 

You might wanna re-check your stats on LeSean. Yeah sure, he only had 1080 yards, with an average of 5.2 YPA. He also had 600 yards receiving, for nearly 1700 all-purpose yards. Then last year he has 1,600 all-purpose yards, along with 20 TDs. He actually had more yards in 2010 than he did in 2011. So before you spout off about someone having "only" so many yards, might wanna make sure it's actually true. :grinno:

 

Yeah ok bro, like u havent defended someone on your team u know who is good before.. A Titan fan SHOULD take defense to his player who is elite and doesnt get the credit hes due. I dont think, nor would expect any OTHER fan of a different team to make a case for him. This time im lucky enough to have someone else who ISNT a Titans fan to agree.

 

Ok im confused on one thing, ill throw out the shitty oline blocking statement even though it was shitty. To Thanatos though, if u say I cant use that line argument to why CJ did pretty bad ( not full reason why ), why can u use the argument that when our line was good, CJ does better? If it cant be used to why his play declined from it, how can u use it for when he was doing "well"?

 

The argument is that if everyone had a good O-line, CJ does as well or even better than, the elite tier of RBs, but if everyone has a shitty O-line, then CJ falls back a good ways. He is a great RB, I just don't have him in my elite tier, that's all. The debate is not between people who think CJ is bad and people who think he's elite. I think he's #7 or #8 in the league.

 

I have him ranked behind a healthy Adrian Peterson, (a big ?), Maurice Jones-Drew, Ray Rice, Matt Forte, Arian Foster, LeSean McCoy, and possibly Jamaal Charles, (assuming Charles is healthy)- and that list is not in order. Not as a fantasy ranking, just as a top-RB ranking.

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

Yea... wtf? CJ as an above average back? He's been a top 10 back for three of his first 4 seasons in the NFL, and we are to assume he's going to be... Above average this upcoming year?

[blotsfan 2,112]

One thing RZ, how can there be 24 starting backs that are "above average" if you're 24th of 32 shouldnt you be below average?

[RazorStar 4,025]

Well most teams run a back by committee offense, so when you consider the amount of guys who get a significant amount of touches, it's over 32 guys. 50 guys hit the 100 carry mark last year, and two guys who didn't had 40 plus catches. so I have a list of just over 50 guys. 24 out of 57 in this case is above average.

[Dutch 874]

No one else in the NFL is averaging higher then 1,411 yards in their careers. That's a pretty high average even with Cj2k's off season last year. Averaging 1,411 yards in your career; that's crazy. Getting 2,000 yards in your sophomore year; (what's a sophomore slump?) that's crazy. All this talk about Cj2K not being elite; more crazy talk. How can you have a higher rushing average then the entire league (with an average year), be the only active player to rush for 2,000 yards and not be elite? Just doesn't add up. Cj2k's resume speaks for itself.

[Thanatos 2,847]

No one else in the NFL is averaging higher then 1,411 yards in their careers. That's a pretty high average even with Cj2k's off season last year. Averaging 1,411 yards in your career; that's crazy. Getting 2,000 yards in your sophomore year; (what's a sophomore slump?) that's crazy. All this talk about Cj2K not being elite; more crazy talk. How can you have a higher rushing average then the entire league (with an average year), be the only active player to rush for 2,000 yards and not be elite? Just doesn't add up. Cj2k's resume speaks for itself.

 

You are completely caught up in statistics. There is more that makes a RB than simply yardage totals.

[GA_Eagle 595]

Yeah ok bro, like u havent defended someone on your team u know who is good before.. A Titan fan SHOULD take defense to his player who is elite and doesnt get the credit hes due. I dont think, nor would expect any OTHER fan of a different team to make a case for him. This time im lucky enough to have someone else who ISNT a Titans fan to agree.

 

Ok im confused on one thing, ill throw out the shitty oline blocking statement even though it was shitty. To Thanatos though, if u say I cant use that line argument to why CJ did pretty bad ( not full reason why ), why can u use the argument that when our line was good, CJ does better? If it cant be used to why his play declined from it, how can u use it for when he was doing "well"?

 

I've defended Johnson with you before. I was mostly busting chops. We've all heard the argument before and I'm a little bored with it.

[Dutch 874]

You are completely caught up in statistics. There is more that makes a RB than simply yardage totals.

 

Elaborate please. What makes an elite RB?

[Eefluxx 113]

Elaborate please. What makes an elite RB?

 

I think besides yardage you have yards per carry, yards per catch, pass blocking, catching, knowing when to go out for the screen as opposed to just going out for the screen, blitz pickup, being able to run behind a shitty line, selling a fake handoff on play action or reverses, running up the middle as well as running around the corner.

 

I haven't watched CJ all that much so I don't know if he does all of this or if he does if he does it well.

 

I am just mentioning some things an elite RB would have to be able to perform.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Eefluxx

[RazorStar 4,025]

Among the things eefluxx posted, I'd have to add making tough yards to the list. When the defense isn't fully geared to stop the run, you can break a lot of big runs, but when it's 4th and 2, you want a back who can make those 2 yards 80-85% of the time, and you absolutely want to make sure your back is not a liability on third down.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

No one else in the NFL is averaging higher then 1,411 yards in their careers. That's a pretty high average even with Cj2k's off season last year. Averaging 1,411 yards in your career; that's crazy. Getting 2,000 yards in your sophomore year; (what's a sophomore slump?) that's crazy. All this talk about Cj2K not being elite; more crazy talk. How can you have a higher rushing average then the entire league (with an average year), be the only active player to rush for 2,000 yards and not be elite? Just doesn't add up. Cj2k's resume speaks for itself.

 

That part I am not unfamiliar with. When Jamal Lewis did it, the next year people were saying he was not a top 3 back in leiu of LT, Curtis Martin, Ricky Williams, and Priest Holmes so it does happen.

[Thanatos 2,847]

Elaborate please. What makes an elite RB?

 

I think besides yardage you have yards per carry, yards per catch, pass blocking, catching, knowing when to go out for the screen as opposed to just going out for the screen, blitz pickup, being able to run behind a shitty line, selling a fake handoff on play action or reverses, running up the middle as well as running around the corner.

 

I haven't watched CJ all that much so I don't know if he does all of this or if he does if he does it well.

 

I am just mentioning some things an elite RB would have to be able to perform.

 

Eefluxx pretty much covers it.

[Dutch 874]

That part I am not unfamiliar with. When Jamal Lewis did it, the next year people were saying he was not a top 3 back in leiu of LT, Curtis Martin, Ricky Williams, and Priest Holmes so it does happen.

 

Well, last year there were more then 3 elite backs; so you technically don't have to be top 3 to be elite. During that time I would consider Jamal Lewis elite. Rookie season over 1,300 yards and over 100 yards and a TD in the superbowl. He followed his next 3 seasons with 3 consecutive 1,000 yard seasons including his history making 2,000 yard season and averaged 1,440 yards during that time frame. That's baller.

[Dutch 874]

Eefluxx pretty much covers it.

 

The bottom line when you create a resume like Cj2k5, it takes more then ONE off year to take you out the elite status. He still reached the benchmark over 1,000 yards.

 

So by your logic, is Phillip Rivers no longer elite?

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

A lot of people just irrationally hate CJ, probably because he's a complete dumbass off the field, but I dunno.

 

People like to believe everything ESPN tells them and they like to think the Titans offensive line was elite when it came to runblocking in his first 3 years, and think the yards he got were "easy", despite the fact that in his 2,000 yard season the Titans run blocking line was average at it's absolute best.

 

I'm not sure 09 was even his most impressive year. 2010 he was absolutely incredible given how much he had to carry the team and how bad the line was. Last year his lack of stamina and out of shape body along side the worst run blocking offensive line in the NFL was his downfall.

 

Munchak realized that and has improved the line with Hutchinson, and has opened competition at C and RG. And he was going to sign a center if fucking Bud Adams didn't have his 90 year old limp dick up Peyton Manning's ass...but oh well.

 

I used to get irritated with all the people irrationally hating on him, but I've learned to ignore it. CJ will just make them look like complete dumbasses come September.

[RazorStar 4,025]

Was Rivers ever elite? Most people say he's a tier below guys like Brady. Whether that's unfounded or not is arguable, but you're runnng in circles. QB's play twice as long as runningbacks do, and any back with over 250 carries should get 1000 yards, that's no achievement, that's expected from a back who gets the ball that often. Yards aren't an acheivement, they're a product of carries, so when you're leading the league in carries, you should be leading the league in yards. I'm not sure how I can make this any clearer when I say that Chris Johnson right now is not Chris Johnson 3 years ago. The fluctuation on great backs is so erratic that you can say one off year is cause for concern.

 

Jamal Anderson in 1998 had 1846 yards, then he gets hurt, in 1999. His bounce back in 2000, barely 1000 yards on 282 carries. Not the same back.

Larry Johnson in 2006 had 1789 yards. Then he falls off a cliff in 2007. He wasn't elite going into 2008.

LaDainian Tomlinson hits a sharp decline in 2008 going from 4.7 YPC, to 3.8. And he was never the same electrifying back.

Shaun Alexander after 2005, same thing. It happens to a lot of runningbacks. They don't have a long enough shelf life for things like past accomplishments bolster what they are now.

 

Meanwhile QB's bounce back from injuries and bad seasons all the time. Dan Marino gets hurt in 93, responds big in 1994 with 30 TD's and 4400+ yards. Tom Brady did the same a few years back after his injury, heck if you want to call Favre a great, just look at how he goes up and down between 2005 and 2010. It's rare for backs to recover from bad years though, and they hardly ever retain elite status.

[.AirMcNair. 1,232]

The issue is you're basing that CJ isn't the same back on a season he skipped all of training camp and pre-season and was completely out of football shape. It's extremely outlandish to sit there and say he isn't going to be the same back based off that, especially when he's only 26/turning 27.

 

If CJ had shown a history prior to this season of slowing down, you'd have a point. But he has not.

[RazorStar 4,025]

I'll do more research on this later, but it's just not common enough for runningbacks to bounce back. I cana understand backs who have bad seasons early in their career and get better like Cedric Benson, but in most cases you never see guys return to elite form after bad seasons.

[Thanatos 2,847]

The bottom line when you create a resume like Cj2k5, it takes more then ONE off year to take you out the elite status. He still reached the benchmark over 1,000 yards.

 

So by your logic, is Phillip Rivers no longer elite?

 

There you go again with yardage totals. CJ is fast as hell. If he has a hole, he is one of the best, if not the best, at hitting it and taking off. If he doesn't have a hole... then he has problems. Again, I'm not saying he's bad, or even just above average. I am not saying that one off-season makes him non-elite. He was never elite in my opinion, because he simply was unable to do what the truly elite backs could. I'm not saying he isn't elite because of last season. He hasn't reached that bar yet. I do think he's top-7 in the league, possibly top-6. That's pretty damn high. I just think the elite tier is just all-around better than him.

 

Phillip Rivers was never elite in my eyes, he was just below that line... so yes, he is still not elite.

Edited July 12, 2012 by Thanatos19

[Dutch 874]

There you go again with yardage totals. CJ is fast as hell. If he has a hole, he is one of the best, if not the best, at hitting it and taking off. If he doesn't have a hole... then he has problems. Again, I'm not saying he's bad, or even just above average. I am not saying that one off-season makes him non-elite. He was never elite in my opinion, because he simply was unable to do what the truly elite backs could. I'm not saying he isn't elite because of last season. He hasn't reached that bar yet. I do think he's top-7 in the league, possibly top-6. That's pretty damn high. I just think the elite tier is just all-around better than him.

 

Phillip Rivers was never elite in my eyes, he was just below that line... so yes, he is still not elite.

 

What made Cj2k not elite then prior to last season?

[Dutch 874]

Was Rivers ever elite? Most people say he's a tier below guys like Brady. Whether that's unfounded or not is arguable, but you're runnng in circles. QB's play twice as long as runningbacks do, and any back with over 250 carries should get 1000 yards, that's no achievement, that's expected from a back who gets the ball that often. Yards aren't an acheivement, they're a product of carries, so when you're leading the league in carries, you should be leading the league in yards. I'm not sure how I can make this any clearer when I say that Chris Johnson right now is not Chris Johnson 3 years ago. The fluctuation on great backs is so erratic that you can say one off year is cause for concern.

 

Jamal Anderson in 1998 had 1846 yards, then he gets hurt, in 1999. His bounce back in 2000, barely 1000 yards on 282 carries. Not the same back.

Larry Johnson in 2006 had 1789 yards. Then he falls off a cliff in 2007. He wasn't elite going into 2008.

LaDainian Tomlinson hits a sharp decline in 2008 going from 4.7 YPC, to 3.8. And he was never the same electrifying back.

Shaun Alexander after 2005, same thing. It happens to a lot of runningbacks. They don't have a long enough shelf life for things like past accomplishments bolster what they are now.

 

Meanwhile QB's bounce back from injuries and bad seasons all the time. Dan Marino gets hurt in 93, responds big in 1994 with 30 TD's and 4400+ yards. Tom Brady did the same a few years back after his injury, heck if you want to call Favre a great, just look at how he goes up and down between 2005 and 2010. It's rare for backs to recover from bad years though, and they hardly ever retain elite status.

 

Who's running in circles? No one is discussing his longevity at this point in his career. He's only played 4 years in the league. Your argument is for RBs later in their career closing in on 30.

 

Your argument with Jamaal Anderson is bouncing back off an injury. That's totally different from this situation.

 

Larry Johnson ALSO suffered an injury (season ending injury) after his two back to back 1,700 yard seasons. Also a different situation.

 

Shaun Alexander was another casualty to an injury as well in 2006 breaking his foot.

 

Ladanian is the only RB that matches your argument BUT Ladanian Tomlinsons decline is after wear and tear from 7 years and 2,365 attempts. That's inevitable at that point in someones career.

 

Loads of carries doesn't amount to leading the league in yards. If that's the case, every team would run the ball 30 times a game and have resumes like CJ2K5. That's just not the case.