Possibility that Ed Reeds ends up in NE next season

[Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014]

It hasn't stopped you from continuing to on this blistering off-road path you are on. I sure would enjoy a conversation or debate that actually stays on topic for once.

 

I post those "unquantifiable" characteristics. You reply saying I hated Adrian Wilson like 3 years ago. Wonderful. I post again asking you to address those "unquantifiables" that I brought up... This time you took what, 2 sentences out of 50, to pretend like you've addressed it.

 

"You see it, I don't, you can't prove it"

 

That's all you said. And there is no way that is holding up in what should be a discussion based on substance and reality -- not futile attempts to save face.

 

So, I will ask yet once again.

 

You claim Ed Reed has lost edge or X Factor. Why? Try using REAL examples to back your claim. You've done a fine job speaking for Ngata and Mathias. And while I don't doubt their agreement with your fluff, it's time to actually back everything up.

 

And there are no straw men on this side of things. I think he is still one of the best, if not the best in the league. You don't. That's the discussion. It's not difficult to see that that discussion moves to.. Why do you think the way you do.

 

I realize it's hard for you to formulate and retort in a manner that doesn't require you to login to PFF or copy and paste some stats... But for everyone involved, can you at least try?

 

I will even leave you with this. You give us why Ed Reeds instincts and ability to play the field are gone, and while I will disagree.. I won't argue it. It will end right there.

 

At this point, I will be content with getting an answer compiled of substance, reality, and not wholly state-driven.

 

First you stated that dutch never said that Ed Reed was the best safety in the league. The fact that it is so lost on you that that was what I was discrediting is...lamentable.

 

Next, you claimed, numerous times despite my saying otherwise, that all I care about are PFF stats. Talk about off topic, lol.

 

You then posted one small paragraph, which according to you is some undeniably strong, substance filled argument that I've been "ignoring".

 

Ed Reed does things in coverage that no PFF Subscription can show you. The way he moves in the backfield... The way he shifts, turns, and attacks the ball. The fact that he is often times not in the place coordinators and QBs are expecting him to be. Not to mention what he does with the ball AFTER he catches it. I'd love to see PFF's grade on his instincts, vision, and INT returns.

 

Out of all of your posts, this is the extent to which you went with it, lmao. You have posted paragraph after paragraph telling me what I'm arguing and whining about PFF and for all your grandstanding, you now say your entire argument comes down to...this. A couple of cliche opinions. You want me to go into depth, fine.

 

Ed Reed has has always made his living camped out deep and played the ball he had a shot at it. He's a gambler that ofter makes the great play on the ball, but he will get beat. The difference is that the last couple years his speed has diminished. He doesn't get in and out of his breaks as quickly and when he does get beat, it's by quicker players that will rack up the YAC on him. His hips are not as fluid and he does not turn and run as quickly as he used to. Not much of this should have needed to be stated seeing as he's aging and it's obvious, but since you require everything to be spelled out for you...

 

I disagree that he's often in places that coordinators don't expect. Ed's not a player that gets moved around schematically like many SS's. He's a FS that sits deep and waits, everyone knows this. The problem has always been getting through him, something teams have been able to do more over the last couple years. You described Polamalu and his role at SS, and it's widely known that Reed and Polamalu play extremely different positions within their respective schemes.

 

With his diminished speed also comes diminished returns (literally) on his interceptions. In 2011 he had 2 INTs in the opening day rout of Pittsburgh that he returned for a total of 25 yards. He later had his third interception and was tackled immediately. In 2012 his best return was 34 yards after breaking an arm tackle by Dwyer before getting dropped. He also had a 34 yard TD return against the Bengals, but he was uncontested and only had to outrun an offensive lineman. In 2010 and earlier years, yeah, Reed was picking off passes and using his speed and agility to rack up yards and TDs. That hasn't been the case the past two years, again, because of his obvious signs of age.

 

Ed Reed was one of the top safeties in the league for a long time, but he's hit the age wall and, while he's still a very good player, he is not the best in the league. There are plenty of younger players having a greater impact on their teams.

Edited January 31, 2013 by Zack_of_Steel

[ATL_Predator+ 1,196]

All I have to say that Ed Reed is still a huge part of the Baltimore Ravens defense. You can look at stats and whatever, and say he sucks here, here, and here...but think about something.

 

 

Think about where the Ravens are now, and where they were at the end of the regular season. The Ravens had lost Webb, Ngata, Suggs, Lewis, for a fair amount of time. The only ones that were keeping that defense together were Kruger, Ellerbe, Pollard, and Reed. Teams were beating the Ravens D into submission, for a player of Ed Reed's age to have to try and compensate for the lack of talent around him at that point of time was ridiculous.

 

Yes. He's not what he's used to be, but he's ALWAYS a person you have to pay special attention to because of how much he means to the Ravens defense.

 

Not the best safety, but still in the top 10.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

You, dutch, and Ngata have all mentioned his unquantifiable "impact", which he no doubt had in the past. I, and presumably Mathias, Razor, and Dmac, do not see this in Mr. Reed anymore. There's no way to prove it one way or another, so I moved on to statistics to, again, supplement (I bold because apparently that's what it takes for you to regard it) the fact that I do not agree with the "intangibles" argument.

 

Incorrect kind sir. I as in ME am not arguing his impact, because honestly it is not what it used to be imo. All I am saying is that he has a HUGE impact because of what OTHER people think.

 

That probably sounds confusing or circular. What I am saying I guess is that Reed is a huge impact because the Brady's, Brees's, Manning's, and so on refuse to test him. However if not for that fear if they were to test him I think he would be exposed. If he did not have his "mystique" and people threw on him than it would not really be an argument.

 

As an example, Ed Reed is probably going to have the biggest impact in the SB. Not because he is that good but because as a young kid in the NFL Kaepernick is going to be told,"Whatever you do, do not throw at Ed Reed. If you do he could change the game in an instant." So he is probably not going to throw as much to one of his favorite targets (either Crab or Davis) if Ed Reed is over the top of him. Even though that in a head up matchup up Vernon Davis would probably eat him alive.

 

I am not really sure that makes any sense and I can not figure out how else to say it other than, he has a huge impact but he should not, but he does. If that makes any fucking sense.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I see what you are saying Ngata and understand. Not gonna try to argue because it would be kind of hard to figure what those QBs and offenses are thinking. And while you may be correct on that, that is a testament to his greatness. QBs have pretty much stopped throwing within 15 yards of Revis for the same reason. Now, I realize he is way younger, in his prime, and still lock down (pre-surgery, anyway), so it isn't the same situation.. But there are parallels. If guys would try throwing on Revis, they would be a lot more successful than not throwing at him at all, you'd think.

 

But it's definitely that respect / fear factor you are talking about. And even if that is the only reason that he is still somewhat respectable... That will go a long way. When a guy still alters the thoughts and approach to the game of his opponent (whether he has regressed mightily or not), he has done his job.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I see what you are saying Ngata and understand. Not gonna try to argue because it would be kind of hard to figure what those QBs and offenses are thinking. And while you may be correct on that, that is a testament to his greatness. QBs have pretty much stopped throwing within 15 yards of Revis for the same reason. Now, I realize he is way younger, in his prime, and still lock down (pre-surgery, anyway), so it isn't the same situation.. But there are parallels. If guys would try throwing on Revis, they would be a lot more successful than not throwing at him at all, you'd think.

 

But it's definitely that respect / fear factor you are talking about. And even if that is the only reason that he is still somewhat respectable... That will go a long way. When a guy still alters the thoughts and approach to the game of his opponent (whether he has regressed mightily or not), he has done his job.

 

I dont think it is a testament to his greatness. I think it is a testament to how great he was. I think next year when he goes to the pats we are going to see it quite a bit.

 

That secondary as a whole is going to suck if Talib leaves. When Reed joins them people are going to still throw and they are going to quickly find that he will get the burned more than he makes a play. That has been a big reason why Jimmy Smith has looked so bad. Ed Reed will look like he has over the top coverage pre snap, then he moves out of position while Jimmy does not see it so he jumps the route on a double move thinking he has help over the top. Well he does not and both get burned. See the first broncos game for prime examples of this.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Right. But my point is whether it's because of how he plays now or how he played 10 years ago... If he is still changing the way opponents play him... That's all you need. I think it's justified, however. We could argue on that all day though. He isn't what he was, but things like ball hawking and instincts don't just diminish exponentially like speed.

[Glanvilles Grits 142]

I think this whole thread breaks down to a few pretty simple questions,

 

Has Ed Reed been playing while battling an injury? Yes.

Is Ed Reed on the decline? Yes.

Is Ed Reed still one of the top safeties in the league? YES.

 

That easy for me. The guy can single handed change how an offense plans for a game. Obviously any defensive player that can do that to an incoming offense is an elite player at his position. There aren't many defensive players that do that any more. I don't like looking at PFF for defensive ratings. It doesn't tell the whole story because there are so many things that they can't account for. More often than not they only account for plays that didn't go well.

 

At his age, no way should Reed be one of the best at his position, but he is. He's great. I think that if the Ravens win the Superbowl on Sunday, he hangs them up when Ray Lewis does. If they don't, then obviously the possibility of moving to the Patriots is real. How much stock are the Patriots willing to put into an aging player that more than likely will only play one more year though?

[Dutch 874]

I think this whole thread breaks down to a few pretty simple questions,

 

Has Ed Reed been playing while battling an injury? Yes.

Is Ed Reed on the decline? Yes.

Is Ed Reed still one of the top safeties in the league? YES.

 

That easy for me. The guy can single handed change how an offense plans for a game. Obviously any defensive player that can do that to an incoming offense is an elite player at his position. There aren't many defensive players that do that any more. I don't like looking at PFF for defensive ratings. It doesn't tell the whole story because there are so many things that they can't account for. More often than not they only account for plays that didn't go well.

 

At his age, no way should Reed be one of the best at his position, but he is. He's great. I think that if the Ravens win the Superbowl on Sunday, he hangs them up when Ray Lewis does. If they don't, then obviously the possibility of moving to the Patriots is real. How much stock are the Patriots willing to put into an aging player that more than likely will only play one more year though?

 

Ed Reed won't make a lot of money and he won't be expecting or demand it. Pats have all the leverage and Reed knows that. If Reed came back, it would ONLY be to play with Belicheck and have another shot to get a ring regardless of win or lose this Sunday.

[Glanvilles Grits 142]

I just don't think he comes back if they win a ring this Sunday.

[BLUE 1,026]

Posted by Michael David Smith on February 1, 2013, 8:42 AM EST

 

Ravens safety Ed Ree is aware of the stories linking him to the Patriots, and he’s not happy about them.

 

Reed said his quotes about being able to see himself in a Patriots uniform have been taken out of context by reporters who are looking to create stories during Super Bowl week.

 

“The bad part about this is that you all ask the question, but don’t write down everything that someone says,” Reed told reporters on Thursday. “People only get a part of what the comment was. I don’t have to say much about that. My heart is in Baltimore. The question is, ‘Would I play for Bill Belicheck?’ Yes. What football player wouldn’t play for Coach Belicheck? Will I be in New England? Most likely not. It’s just terrible that people get half of the story.”

 

Reed will become a free agent in March, and the Patriots may be among several teams that will offer him a contract. But Reed thinks talk of his landing in New England is just talk.

 

Source: ProFootballTalk

[Milla4Prez63 678]

If he doesn't retire, I see him ending up with the Colts. He has a very close relationship with Chuck Pagano and Indy has cap space.

[housemd 338]

According to CBS' Jason La Canfora, "a lot of people believe" impending free agent Ed Reed will sign with the Colts.

 

Reed — who doesn't even have an agent — appears set to hire proper representation and hit the open market. Although Ravens owner Steve Bisciotti isn't certain Reed will even play in 2013, he admits it might not be in Baltimore if he does. Reed would be reuniting with coach Chuck Pagano in Indianapolis, who served as Baltimore's defensive coordinator from 2008-11. Safey was a major problem area for the Colts in 2012.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Don't go from SB champ to Indy. Get out of here. lmao

[AL_Royalty 489]

The way I see it, Reed is already a rich man who has been playing for the ring that has always alluded him. Couple the facts that he has it now, and he could get a coaching job tomorrow, and I don't think we see him playing anywhere next season. I'd day that we're more likely to see him take a year or two off, do a few guest spots on CBS or ESPN, and then make his return on one of his former head coach's staff.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I could see him on the sidelines, but not so convinced he won't play. Not sure how much he wants to keep playing though.

[AL_Royalty 489]

I could see him on the sidelines, but not so convinced he won't play. Not sure how much he wants to keep playing though.

I don't know what he would want to keep playing for. He's accomplished everything that he can on the field, and the only new thing he can really achieve won't happen until 5 years after he retires. Quitting now would actually further his legacy along. The physical beating that he is probably taking being the last line of defense all these years must start weighing heavily on him these days.

 

Besides. Holding a clipboard is far safer for 30 plussers than running around taking on the Megatrons and APs of the world.

[housemd 338]

Coach John Harbaugh said the Ravens will "work like crazy" to get impending free agent Ed Reed re-signed.

 

"We had that conversation on the bus ride away from the stadium actually," Harbaugh said. "He and I both agreed that we want him back. I want him back, and Ed wants to come back." The problem is that the cap-strapped Ravens probably won't be able to afford market value for the future Hall of Famer. Although he'll be 35 in September and has a numerous injury red flags, Reed is expected to attract significant interest around the league. The Colts, Patriots and Saints are all possible suitors.

[AL_Royalty 489]

Now that I think about it, apart from QBs, how many HOFers play their whole career for one team these days? Free agency has made that a bit of an outdated notion. Hell, even Peyton left. I hope he doesn't go play somewhere else. Either re-sign or resign. Stay golden, Ponyboy.

Edited February 5, 2013 by B-isforBowe

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Ray Lewis.

 

And ya, I agree that he has nothing left to prove. He's one of the best we have ever seen, he now has the hardware. But it isn't as easy for everybody to just walk away from the game. Ed Reed might just have to have a season or two where he gets torched to assure himself he can't play anymore or just get to the point where his body won't take any more punishment.

 

But again, who really knows? I don't think Ed even does at this point.

[AL_Royalty 489]

Ray Lewis.

 

And ya, I agree that he has nothing left to prove. He's one of the best we have ever seen, he now has the hardware. But it isn't as easy for everybody to just walk away from the game. Ed Reed might just have to have a season or two where he gets torched to assure himself he can't play anymore or just get to the point where his body won't take any more punishment.

 

But again, who really knows? I don't think Ed even does at this point.

That's true. I suppose that's why you get guys like Rice, Favre, Bruce Smith, etc. who play past their prime. They're football players, and at the pro level that probably becomes as much who they are as what they are.

[housemd 338]

GM Ozzie Newsome is optimistic the Ravens will re-sign free agent Ed Reed.

 

"I think he realizes there may be some other options out there, but I think if you watched him, if you watched his body language over the course of the last eight to 10 days that he loves being here in Baltimore," Newsome said Thursday. "And I think we can use that to help make that relationship last a little bit longer." Newsome hinted the franchise tag will not be an option for Reed, meaning any deal would likely be a 2-3 year pact. There's a real chance Reed leaves, but it's far from a certainty.

[baltimoreravens 19]

I'll be disgusted if he is a Patriot next year. Or a Steeler. Or a Redskin. Any other team I could probably deal with if I had to, but I'd rather he retire a Raven.

[housemd 338]

I'll be disgusted if he is a Patriot next year. Or a Steeler. Or a Redskin. Any other team I could probably deal with if I had to, but I'd rather he retire a Raven.

Don't worry,he won't be a Steeler.

[Milla4Prez63 678]

Now that I think about it, apart from QBs, how many HOFers play their whole career for one team these days? Free agency has made that a bit of an outdated notion. Hell, even Peyton left. I hope he doesn't go play somewhere else. Either re-sign or resign. Stay golden, Ponyboy.

 

Edited February 8, 2013 by Milla4Prez63