Let's Discuss this Ridiculous Public Restroom Issue

[BwareDWare94 723]

Man, every time I see this thread title cut off, I think this is a thread about discussing the ridiculous fiction that Barack Obama doesn't know what he's doing. Instead its just a good chunk of TGP being transphobic

 

I think there's a difference between being transphobic and being wary of more people you don't know in the bathroom with your children. It's not necessarily even about transgender people. I for one think it's awful that some people are assuming that they are predators when they are people who deal with things that many of us can't even fathom. However, I take no issue when parents of young children seem worried about the idea of public restrooms accessible to all people.

 

And lastly, I just can't wrap my head around spending so much money on this issue when there's a pretty simple solution that many Americans need to hear in many situations, not just this bathroom issue--suck it up, buttercup. You're an adult, now. You're going to be uncomfortable in many situations. That's called life.

 

Transgender people and others who struggle with gender identity deserve equal pay, equal job availability, and absolutely no discrimination from citizens in general. All this restrooms issue is doing is deflecting our focus away from taking care of things that actually matter.

 

[blotsfan 2,112]

 

I think there's a difference between being transphobic and being wary of more people you don't know in the bathroom with your children. It's not necessarily even about transgender people. I for one think it's awful that some people are assuming that they are predators when they are people who deal with things that many of us can't even fathom. However, I take no issue when parents of young children seem worried about the idea of public restrooms accessible to all people.

 

And lastly, I just can't wrap my head around spending so much money on this issue when there's a pretty simple solution that many Americans need to hear in many situations, not just this bathroom issue--suck it up, buttercup. You're an adult, now. You're going to be uncomfortable in many situations. That's called life.

 

Transgender people and others who struggle with gender identity deserve equal pay, equal job availability, and absolutely no discrimination from citizens in general. All this restrooms issue is doing is deflecting our focus away from taking care of things that actually matter.

 

 

Why doesn't this line of reasoning apply to you? Trans people spend their lives feeling like they're a woman in a man's body (or vice versa) and often have to go through a lot of shit to be the gender they feel is correct (and there actually is a lot of evidence for a biological basis for being transgender btw). Why should they have to be told "no, despite all that youve done, you still dont count." Even if you don't think they should be considered the gender they feel that they are, what good does it do to be shitty to them?

 

And please, look at the photo I posted of the trans guy earlier in the thread. If you would honestly be ok with him going into a women's bathroom, then how can you even stop a cis man anyways? Are you going to have someone inspect everyone's genitals before they go into the bathroom?

[Cherry 1,302]

 

For Blots.

 

 

Anyways, if that comment on being transphobic is directed at me I'm very disappointed in you, Blots. I haven't once said anything that could be construed as legitimately transphobic; and honestly I don't think anyone else has said anything that could really be seen in that light. It's not a matter of hating transpeople, or wanting to limit rights, people are just uncomfortable with someone who is clearly not the same sex they are. Both parties in this situation will be uncomfortable to some degree. I think the very small minority should settle for a family restroom or a neutral restroom (Razor said he hasn't run into many but I run into them a lot here in the US.)

 

Does that make me transphobic to think we should settle for an agreement where both parties are relatively comfortable and can use the restroom like it was the goal all along?

 

I think the attempt by the trans community is very bold and empowering for them, but I think it is definitely slowing down the process of educating others. You don't educate people on transgenders by forcing people to go into the bathroom with them. You start with social movements for understanding and the struggles they go through. Until then they're stereotyped as a creepy person trying to sneak into another bathroom.

 

Bware the issue with using genitalia to decide this issue is the image Blots posted. The person in the photo clearly doesn't belong in the women's restroom, and I think they would run into no problems in the men's restroom. It should be up to the individual if they believe they should go into the restroom. But that said I do think we should be brutally honest and tell them if they stand out and don't fit the restroom they go into. Let's say the person in Blots photo is male to female instead of female to male. Has a vagina and identifies as a female. But is clearly still a male? What do they do then? They'd likely be uncomfortable in the men's restroom. So again, using their own good sense of judgment, they should use the neutral restroom to avoid making others uncomfortable.

 

The minority will always push for equality, and as they push they will pick up more and more people. I think within the next 20 years nobody will care because they will be educated well and used to transgender people. I haven't grown up with them in my constant sphere of life but I am in a much more liberal age group than most and because of that I've been around quite a few of people who are or support transgenders. I understand the struggle that they face and the reasons they want to go into the restroom of their choice. But I also understand the feelings of those who disagree. People who are just as uncomfortable with a transgender in their restroom as a transgender is in the other restroom. It's an endless loop of "Suck it up. Nobody cares about your comfort." On both sides of the argument. And for now I'll side with majority until they are no longer the majority.

Edited April 16, 2016 by Chernobyl426

[ATL_Predator+ 1,196]

Norms are excuses for past behaviour, and norms change over time. Or do you want me to force you to sit in the back of the bus, or use your own water fountain, since you can't use the white people water fountains? Let people use the fucking bathroom they want to use, if they end up using that privilege for nefarious purposes, then the law is there to strike them down for sexual harassment and abuse.

Are you really going to compare something people that are forced into to something people choose to be?

 

It's like if you play football you're gonna have to take the good with the bad. If you want to be a tranny. You're not going to have the best of both world's, you simply won't. If you are taken into slavery from the day you were born it's not a choice.

Don't make me hate you.

[Cherry 1,302]

Are you really going to compare something people that are forced into to something people choose to be?

 

It's like if you play football you're gonna have to take the good with the bad. If you want to be a tranny. You're not going to have the best of both world's, you simply won't. If you are taken into slavery from the day you were born it's not a choice.

Don't make me hate you.

 

Biologically speaking you're incorrect. Being transgender is many times not a choice. Probably a few attention whores here or there but there is a scientific explanation for why someone would identify as a different gender than their sex.

[ATL_Predator+ 1,196]

 

Biologically speaking you're incorrect. Being transgender is many times not a choice. Probably a few attention whores here or there but there is a scientific explanation for why someone would identify as a different gender than their sex.

 

Cutting off your penis and getting a tit and ass job (Or vice versa) is most def not a choice, what was I thinking?

 

I could maybe understand being a lesbian or homosexual..but once you start cutting off body parts and replacing them with others that's on you.

[Cherry 1,302]

 

Cutting off your penis and getting a tit and ass job (Or vice versa) is most def not a choice, what was I thinking?

 

I could maybe understand being a lesbian or homosexual..but once you start cutting off body parts and replacing them with others that's on you.

 

Of course it's a choice to have sexual reassignment surgery. That's not what I'm referring to when I say being transgender is not always a choice. I'm referring to the chemical imbalances in someones brain that makes them more prone to identifying with a different gender.

[RazorStar 4,025]

Not all transgendered people get surgery either. There are varying stages to how far someone will go to that end. And no, being transgendered is not a choice, it's a condition of genetics, same as the colour of your skin and the propensity that you will be discriminated against because of those deviations from the norm. This bathroom issue is a perfect encapsulation of what transgendered people suffer on a regular basis, and the typical thoughts people will have when thinking about them, immediately putting them into the category of freaks and sex offenders. They aren't using a different restroom because they're monsters, they're doing it because they feel that's where they should go to take a leak.

[OSUViking 505]

I used to subscribe to the argument that trans people shouldn't be allowed to go into the bathroom of their choice. My concern was that non-trans people would take advantage of it. I've done a fair bit of research into it, and I really have to say I don't think there is anything wrong with people using whichever bathroom they choose.

[Thanatos 2,847]

I don't see the big deal. Is the argument against seriously... "My daughter could get raped"? Really? That's like being afraid of being near a gay man because you think he is going to bend you over and fuck you in the ass.

 

 

 

Favre and I agree on a political issue.

 

This thread is over.

 

(They want to use the bathroom they identify with because they just need to use the bathroom, guys. That is really all there is to it.)

[GA_Eagle 595]

I'm fascinated by reading opinions on this because up until a few months ago I'd never even given it a second thought. I honestly don't think it's an issue. I work with a transgender man that you wouldn't ever realize used to be physically a woman. A full beard and deep voice, etc. I've never asked and never will ask if he has had surgery because it isn't appropriate in the environment but if he went into a ladies room, people would be more afraid of that then the other way around.

 

This seems like another non-issue to argue over while there are other things we can be worried about.

[JetsFan4Life 542]

 

Seriously though, let them go to the bathroom the identify with.

[oochymp 2,393]

every once in a while (actually, rather often) there's an issue that I know exactly how I feel about but I can't figure out how to explain it, fortunately on this one Colbert nails it:

[Thanatos 2,847]

I do have a thought here guys.

 

Trans people have been using the bathroom of their identified gender for a long time, albeit "illegally". How many times have you heard of one abusing it?

Edited April 28, 2016 by Thanatos

[Cherry 1,302]

I do have a thought here guys.

 

Trans people have been using the bathroom of their identified gender for a long time, albeit "illegally". How many times have you heard of one abusing it?

 

The concern is not trans people abusing the restroom. The concern is other people taking advantage of the law and gender identification for inappropriate purposes. Anyone who thinks a legitimate trans person is going into the bathroom to rape someone or watch little kids is a misguided and uneducated, to be blunt, dipshit.

[JetsFan4Life 542]

 

The concern is not trans people abusing the restroom. The concern is other people taking advantage of the law and gender identification for inappropriate purposes. Anyone who thinks a legitimate trans person is going into the bathroom to rape someone or watch little kids is a misguided and uneducated, to be blunt, dipshit.

 

And anyone who thinks that allowing this would either persuade/stop someone who is going to go into a bathroom to rape or watch little kids is also misguided. How would this in any way effect a guy who wants to check out little boys?

[Cherry 1,302]

 

And anyone who thinks that allowing this would either persuade/stop someone who is going to go into a bathroom to rape or watch little kids is also misguided. How would this in any way effect a guy who wants to check out little boys?

 

Normalizes potentially suspicious people going into the bathroom of their choice.

[RazorStar 4,025]

So when do we get laws about catholic priests in public bathrooms? Or teachers? Hell, just make sure no one can use public bathrooms, that'll work.

[Cherry 1,302]

Because when I wanna sexually harass people, I dress as a priest.

 

Razor pls. If a male teacher or priest went into a women's restroom they would be in some shit. Whether it's legal shit or vigilante ass beatings. The average person is more concerned with the safety and personal health of people close to them in the bathroom rather than the happiness of a small percentage of society.

[RazorStar 4,025]

The personal health of people are not in fucking danger in the bathroom because of transsexual people! The personal health of people are in danger of sexual predators who do not give a flying fuck what the law is when they want to go ahead and abuse or rape someone. These are not preventative measures put into place because of the fear of sexual assault, these are preventative measures put into place because of the fear of the majority against minorities.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ov-ocQpQtrw

Edited April 29, 2016 by RazorStar

[Cherry 1,302]

I agree completely. The personal health of people is endangered by sexual predators, not transgendered people. Let's say a sexual predator wants to enter the women's restroom and try to spy on them. He is caught and asked why he was in there and potentially spying on women. Is his answer going to be "I'm a pervert and wanted to sneak into the women's restroom." No. It's going to be, "I identify as a woman. Let me use the bathroom I prefer. I'm just trying to do what feels right."

 

Is it fucked up and unfair to transgender folks? Of course it is. But I put a higher premium on the comfort and safety of 99.7% of society over the comfort of an incredibly small minority.

[oochymp 2,393]

but is that really that much easier to say than "sorry, I must have misread the sign" or "I really had to go and wasn't paying attention"?

[Cherry 1,302]

but is that really that much easier to say than "sorry, I must have misread the sign" or "I really had to go and wasn't paying attention"?

 

It's a lot easier to get out of it IMO.

[blotsfan 2,112]

No. It's going to be, "I identify as a woman. Let me use the bathroom I prefer. I'm just trying to do what feels right.

What is stopping me from using the women's room and saying that I'm a FTM transgender person and I'm using the bathroom that fits my genitals?

[oochymp 2,393]

 

It's a lot easier to get out of it IMO.

I think you underestimate how forgiving people are of confusion, and blots brings up a very good point as well