Louisiana passes "Blue Lives Matter" law

[seanbrock 1,684]

Unfortunately, if she originally grabs her taser instead of her pistol, we probably wouldn't be talking about this. It is manslaughter at best though.

 

Some type of force was necessary. He looked to be drugged up, he was not complying, and his hands were definitely not up. So I'm not sure where all of the BS rhetoric of "He had his hands up", "he was complying", "his car broke down. he was innocent" is coming from. It's almost like people did not watch the video.

To me though, cops should be held to a higher standard. As a cop you're trained to protect and serve and save lives not take them. If somebody doesn't have a gun but if so much of a threat to you that you have to shoot and kill them despite having a taser and pepper spray and training to be able to physically take down somebody then you probably shouldn't be a cop because you're a coward.

[ATL_Predator+ 1,196]

As someone in law enforcement. I take it upon myself to actively be proficient in my job and duties in terms of training.

 

However, there's a larger portion of law enforcement that is former military. Former military that is run though a paramilitary police academy and if you don't love the military you're wrong. There's a lot.. A LOT of no brained door kickers and big ego'd douchebags that are in police work.

 

Most of these guys are already assholes before even day one on the job, and whenever they feel slightly threatened.. they panic. I've seen it in person and these guys think they are in the middle of Fallujah in 2003.

 

Most officers don't take the time to be involved in their communities either. Which is something I absolutely hate. No, you don't have to suck their dicks as an officer. But, being a coach for a high school basketball team or just being someone that's not a complete random in the community goes a long long way. Repoir seems to be a thing of the past and it's a damn shame.

 

The most effective police departments in the country are those that are most active and involved in their communities. Think about it, do you know one officer in your residing city? If you do, good for you. If you don't... how would you feel if you are coming home from a party after 2 or 3 drinks because they see that your taillight is out? Your light is out, they come up to you and ask you if you've had anything to drink tonight...

 

You say.. yes officer just a few... just a few is probable cause for them to make your life hell. They can search your vehicle search you and if you are even an ounce hesitant or non compliant they will assume that you have something to hide.

 

They search your car and in the backseat you have some open containers of beer but more importantly you have a small baggie of marijuana underneath your backseat.

 

Immediately, that officer locks in and detains you. All of a sudden, this stop for a tailight turns into something much bigger for the officer...

 

Stopping this story for one moment, if you knew this officer prior from him just being a decent contributing member of the community.. do you think this stop would even go past 'Get that twilight fixed man, have a good day' Not guaranteed but the chances of you getting home without being treated like an unknown convict would most likely go up.

 

Police forgot the fundamentals of being a quality citizen a long time ago. They demand respect when they give out slim to none on a regular basis and it's no surprise we see all these incidents happening today.

 

It's all fine and good to be proactive in policing.. but if you don't know what respect is and don't know or relate with people in community you're going to get resistance because you are a government entity seemingly trying to be the big bad wolf when people are just trying to live.. so of course.. tensions will be high because 2 strangers meeting for the first time isn't awkward enough.

 

Just my thoughts.

Edited May 3, 2017 by DonnyTrump

[blotsfan 2,112]

So I didn't know this about Louisiana's police/prison system. This is beyond depressing (one of them twitter threads).

 

https://twitter.com/samswey/status/865602050209357825

[Omerta+ 1,206]

So I didn't know this about Louisiana's police/prison system. This is beyond depressing (one of them twitter threads).

 

https://twitter.com/samswey/status/865602050209357825

 

Is your problem that they are working while in prison ? I know a few people who have been in the system and I myself have done some time (4 months for misdemeanor assault) and going outside in any capacity was a privilege. And I dont know if you have been to Louisiana but this time of year and for the next 5 months it is hell on earth. Them working inside with an AC where the mosquitoes are not eating you alive is a pretty good thing. Especially when you consider what their alternative would be. Sitting in hot concrete boxes sweating their ass off with mosquitoes everywhere. I see no problem with this.

[RazorStar 4,025]

I think it's more the prison industrial system drives wages down and makes it impossible for employees to make a living wage, and incentivises filling the prisons to make cheap labour.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I think it's more the prison industrial system drives wages down and makes it impossible for employees to make a living wage, and incentivises filling the prisons to make cheap labour.

 

I read that douches tweetstorm and it did not seem that is what he meant. That said, the point you made is a fair one, and one that I can get behind. We definitely need to rework the justice system in general. I just dont ascribe to the thought that making them work is beneath them and cruel or whatever these bleeding heart liberals will have people believe.

[Thanatos 2,847]

Making them work for basically no pay, when the prison is predominantly black, in a deep south state run mainly by white bureaucrats, doesn't seem the least bit questionable to you, Ngata? They should be paid minimum wage.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Making them work for basically no pay, when the prison is predominantly black, in a deep south state run mainly by white bureaucrats, doesn't seem the least bit questionable to you, Ngata? They should be paid minimum wage.

 

I am not going to get into this racial trap debate, it is all bullshit and I wont play.

 

No it does not seem questionable to me as it happens in every state, to every color.

 

I do not believe they should be paid, it would cause problems imo, not to mention they do not deserve it while in. They should behave, get out, then get paid like the rest of us who never want to sacrifice our freedom for dumb decisions again.

[Thanatos 2,847]

Right because the only people in jail are those who deserve to be there.

 

The "war on drugs" puts half those people in there because they smoke weed. This is nothing but sheer state-sponsored slavery, and the only way you're okay with it is if somehow you're convinced the authority in Louisiana has nothing but the best interests of their citizens in mind.

 

Did you read the whole thing? Or did you just knock it off as another "racial trap"?

 

Why would it cause problems to give prisoners their fair share for their work? They weren't sentenced to hard labor, they were sentenced to a prison term. I would argue it causes problems to NOT pay them, given that it hurts the economy, since those jobs could go to people who are not prisoners, but they never will because they can use prison labor for free.

 

You don't get to have people work for you for free. Just because you're a prisoner doesn't mean you forfeit your right to be human.

Edited May 23, 2017 by Thanatos

[blotsfan 2,112]

Racism isn't a problem, said the white man.

[Thanatos 2,847]

That is not what he said, blots. Don't put words in someone else's mouth I fucking hate that.

[blotsfan 2,112]

I hate all black people

 

What the fuck is wrong with you?!

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Right because the only people in jail are those who deserve to be there.

 

The "war on drugs" puts half those people in there because they smoke weed. This is nothing but sheer state-sponsored slavery, and the only way you're okay with it is if somehow you're convinced the authority in Louisiana has nothing but the best interests of their citizens in mind.

 

Did you read the whole thing? Or did you just knock it off as another "racial trap"?

 

Why would it cause problems to give prisoners their fair share for their work? They weren't sentenced to hard labor, they were sentenced to a prison term. I would argue it causes problems to NOT pay them, given that it hurts the economy, since those jobs could go to people who are not prisoners, but they never will because they can use prison labor for free.

 

You don't get to have people work for you for free. Just because you're a prisoner doesn't mean you forfeit your right to be human.

 

Are you seriously going to try to make the case that most people in prison are innocent of wrongdoing ? The war on drugs is stupid and its responsible for 48% of incarcerations. Almost a quarter of those are for weed. So that means 12.5% probably should not be in there. See what you did, was say there are people who do not belong in there, and state that since those people dont deserve to be there you can paint the entire prison population that way. The second thing you did was say half were in there for weed, which is another misrepresentation on your part, and I am not sure if it was purposeful or not. The true statement is a little less than half are in there for illicit drugs. You do not state the division of statistics whether it was weed, crack, meth, heroin, pills, or cocaine.

 

12.5% is the percentage of people who are in jail for marijuana.

 

http://norml.org/news/2006/10/12/nearly-one-in-eight-us-drug-prisoners-are-behind-bars-for-pot-taxpayers-

spending-over-1-billion-annually-to-incarcerate-pot-offenders

 

Of those they do not discern which of those are for trafficking and which are for possession alone. The federal maximum for marijuana is up to 1 year in prison for simple possession. Most states in fact only fine you, so it is not like there is this huge number of people in prison for smoking pot.

 

https://www.ncjrs.gov/ondcppubs/publications/pdf/whos_in_prison_for_marij.pdf

 

Most of the people who are in jail for weed or weed related offenses longer than a year were trafficking or it was a parole violation for weed. Now I understand that is splitting hairs, but seriously you were let off once, why would you do it again ? Is it worth it? If you dont value your freedom or your family enough to not do things that are illegal that is a stupid problem, not a drug problem. Millions of Americans resist temptation everyday. The only instance where I disagree with that is in chronic pain problems, but in more than half of the US medicinal Marijuana is legal, and in the ones that are not opiods are allowed with prescription. Granted they are no better than pot, and are in fact worse, but the pain management line s so overused.

 

Then there is this topic of legalization. I agree it should be legal, absolutely it should. Unfortunately it is not, so dont break the fucking law.

 

There are distinctions that must be made, if you are in county most likely you are awaiting trial and can bond out on drug offenses. You do not get sent to prison often for "simple possession"

 

And again of this 48% of drug arrests 25% of those are for weed which brings the number of people in jail for weed down to 12.5% MAX for ALL weed related issues are represented in state and federal prisons so it is not this crisis it is made out to be. Should it be zero for possession, sure, but lets not act like the half you claimed where all for weed. I think you knew that already though, it just didnt suit the narrative.

 

As to being paid, I will tell you why I think it is a terrible idea.

 

1.) Prisoners will kill each other over a pack of pall malls from the cantina, or some honey buns on commissary day. I am not sure giving them money is a good idea since you could probably be coaxed for to do a lot of worse things for with substantial money.

 

2.) The odds of bribery go up exponentially among the guards and that is something that is already a problem that will only be exacerbated by paying people money.

 

3.) What are they going to spend it on? What is the point of being in prison if they get tempurpedic beds, big screen TV's, and cable. Really essentially all you are doing is allowing someone to live as comfortable as they did on the outside except now the taxpayers are paying their bills like rent, utilities, and we are paying for their free healthcare. For most that is a great deal and I think it probably would encourage more crime. The other side to that is if they earn money and have more possessions prison violence will go up as others who have less money will take possessions by force or will get retaliated on by force from the person whom they stole.

 

That is how prison really is, and as well meaning as you are trying to be it would cause more problems than it would solve.

Edited May 23, 2017 by Omerta

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Racism isn't a problem, said the white man.

 

You do realize that discounting my opinion because I am white is racist right ?

 

Not to mention this is the stupidest fucking piece of logic there has ever been right. I am not black thus I am not qualified to speak on the matter ever right ?

 

Well then could you and all other civilians please refrain from bitching about the military budget since you were not the ones with fucking sandbags for armor in the floorboard in Tal Afar, Mosul, or Fallujah ?

 

We spend to much on the military, says far left guy who has never been in the military. See how that works.

[blotsfan 2,112]

Oh shit! I got "serve your country yet?"ed!!!

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Oh shit! I got "serve your country yet?"ed!!!

 

[blotsfan 2,112]

I'd say the fact that you immediately look at the situation where black people are incarcerated at a much higher rate than white people and assume that's a complete coincidence is misguided at best.

 

Also, my theoretical military budget cuts would involve there being less people who need to wear sandbags for armor in Tal Afar, Mosul, or Fallujah so I don't feel too bad about that.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

I'd say the fact that you immediately look at the situation where black people are incarcerated at a much higher rate than white people and assume that's a complete coincidence is misguided at best.

 

Also, my theoretical military budget cuts would involve there being less people who need to wear sandbags for armor in Tal Afar, Mosul, or Fallujah so I don't feel too bad about that.

 

It is uncanny how often one guy can be completely wrong and still have the same conviction as the very first time. I was not talking about black people I was talking about people in jail, marijuana, and earning money in jail. I actually never mentioned race that was you and Thanatos. Don't pin that shit on me, just because I can hold a conversation without race coming into, or calling someone racist is not a problem on my end. Now the fact that you cant, well...

[blotsfan 2,112]

It is uncanny how often one guy can be completely wrong and still have the same conviction as the very first time. I was not talking about black people I was talking about people in jail, marijuana, and earning money in jail. I actually never mentioned race that was you and Thanatos. Don't pin that shit on me, just because I can hold a conversation without race coming into, or calling someone racist is not a problem on my end. Now the fact that you cant, well...

I am not going to get into this racial trap debate, it is all bullshit and I wont play.

 

No it does not seem questionable to me as it happens in every state, to every color.

You said the idea that racism could be at play is bullshit.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

This is exactly the "race trap" I was talking about. On these board especially in places you frequent it is impossible to not being pulled into a debate about how racist I am, or how sexist I am.

 

Serious question. Are you happy with your life? You seem to be incapable of carrying on a conversation without calling me sexist,racist, or what have you. I can also assume that you apply this in real life. This has to be hard to cultivate social circles, have adult conversations to vent about things, have reasoned discourse in the pursuit of knowledge or anything fun really. I hope you are, and I hope your personal life is much different and that one day you will not have such a terribly jaded perspective where you live in a world where all people are racist or sexist.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

You said the idea that racism could be at play is bullshit.

 

...LOL

 

Literally never said that. You just assumed that is what I meant. What I meant I just stated we can not talk about an issue without my race being questioned and how I feel about other races. You truly are the most racist person I know and I have never shook your hand or bought you a beer.

[blotsfan 2,112]

The whole tweet thread was about the racist overtones of the Louisiana prison/forced labor system. If you didn't think that was relevant to the topic then I don't know what to tell you.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

The whole tweet thread was about the racist overtones of the Louisiana prison/forced labor system. If you didn't think that was relevant to the topic then I don't know what to tell you.

 

I was remarking on the idea that I do not believe that prison labor is not really this terrible thing, and that how the racism was being forced onto the article by the writer because he clearly has not seen many prisons. Almost everyone works in prison.

 

Then me and Thanatos started talking and it evolved into weed. I literally wanted nothing to do with racism but as per the usual it is impossible to avoid.

Edited May 24, 2017 by Omerta

[Cherry 1,302]

I think the problem is having prisoners work in general. You're sentenced to incarceration. Not incarceration and labor. We need to be stricter with rulings anyways. No more serving six months of a three year sentence because of good behavior. That's bullshit, and it isn't a deterrent.

[blotsfan 2,112]

I think the problem is having prisoners work in general. You're sentenced to incarceration. Not incarceration and labor. We need to be stricter with rulings anyways. No more serving six months of a three year sentence because of good behavior. That's bullshit, and it isn't a deterrent.

 

Unfortunately, the 14th amendment explicitly says slavery is ok in the case of prisoners. While this was initially just so they could have prisoners run small farms to feed the prison population, the for-profit prison system has turned it into the disaster it is today.

 

However, I don't think the solution to mass incarceration is harsher punishments. A complete ban on for-profit prisons, stricter police monitoring, and judicial reform to get rid of the judges with a history of racial (and other) bias in their sentencing would help far more.

 

And yes Omerta, it isn't explicitly racial, white people are imprisoned and forced to do labor too, but black people get arrested, convicted, and sentenced much stricter than white people. Speaking of weed, marijuana usage is about the same rate for white and black people, but black people are way more likely to be arrested for it. Thats why you can't avoid race in this topic. Its such a major part of it.

Edited May 24, 2017 by blotsfan