BLUE 1,026 Posted May 5, 2011 (edited) Per Rotoworld.com: According to the Houston Chronicle, the Texans will use Mario Williams at outside linebacker in their new 3-4.Mario is 6'7/290, so he'll be the biggest linebacker in NFL history. (Even bigger than Levon Kirkland.) The Patriots once considered pursuing Julius Peppers (6'7/280) to play outside 'backer in their 3-4, although Williams isn't quite as athletic. Still, it will give him a better chance at sacks than 3-4 end. Connor Barwin and Brooks Reed will compete for the job opposite Mario. Source: John McClain on Twitter May 5, 8:59 AM Edited May 5, 2011 by BLUE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BwareDWare94 723 Posted May 5, 2011 That's a big motherfucker. I wonder if he's necessarily fast enough to be used like Ware was. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phenomenal TJ 28 Posted May 5, 2011 I'm assuming it'll be a strictly rush backer basis. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KeVo 176 Posted May 5, 2011 This Texan defense is gonna be something fierce next season. It's somewhat comforting knowing they still lack a true NT even though Wade said he could work around that. I'd hate to have a 6'7 290 lb guy running straight at me, ears pinned back, ready to knock someone the hell out. I think he's athletic enough to actually do it as well! If you have seen him, he looks lean for 290 and gets around real well, so I think he can be used as a Ware type player. He probably won't put up the same numbers though. It will be something to watch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BLUE 1,026 Posted May 5, 2011 By Paul Kuharsky John McClain’s story on the Texans’ change of plans for Mario Williams arrives Friday. The plan is for Williams to play the same role as DeMarcus Ware did for Smith in Dallas, said McClain. That’s as a weakside outside linebacker who rushes 95 percent of the time. Williams will surely lose weight, but I don’t know about the idea of messing with him. He’s two inches taller than Ware and finished last season listed nearly 30 pounds heavier. Any snaps with Williams dropping, beyond a handful to cause confusion, are snaps wasting a premier pass rusher’s best talent. This is quite a change from what the Texans said when Phillips came in with his 3-4. Then, the company line was that Williams would be what Bruce Smith was in the same system for Phillips in Buffalo. When I talked to Bruce Smith about that comparison, he didn’t say a word about standing up as a linebacker. What’s changed in Houston? The Texans drafted J.J. Watt No. 11 overall. That gives the Texans three quality ends in Williams, Antonio Smith and Watt. The initial thinking was that the Texans would be deep and get creative. I didn’t think it meant a big change, certainly not one that would turn Williams all the way into a linebacker. He's stood up for plays before, but nowhere near on the scale we might expect now. Smith’s a very good defensive coach. So I want to see what this looks like. But I am skeptical of any move that takes a guy out of a position where he’s been successful. We’ll revisit when we see the quotes and explanations in McClain’s piece, I suspect. Source: ESPN Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FartWaffles 1,857 Posted May 6, 2011 That's a big motherfucker. I wonder if he's necessarily fast enough to be used like Ware was. I know forty times are pretty insignificant, but Mario wasn't much slower than Ware's and he may lose weight to get faster, who knows? Ware: 4.56 Mario: 4.65 I'm not really sure what to think about this, because I felt more at ease envisioning Mario as a defensive end that on occasion would rush as a linebacker. I guess I just gotta trust Wade on this one... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RANGA+ 1,210 Posted May 6, 2011 Mario has great quickness and agility for a guy his size...but I don't how well that will translate when he stands up. It will be harder for him to get down and pickup leverage on blockers when he's on two feet. He's one of the premier pass rushers in the league though, so I can understand why Wade wouldn't want to use him at DE in a 3-4. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241 Posted May 6, 2011 (edited) I know forty times are pretty insignificant, but Mario wasn't much slower than Ware's and he may lose weight to get faster, who knows? Ware: 4.56 Mario: 4.65 I'm not really sure what to think about this, because I felt more at ease envisioning Mario as a defensive end that on occasion would rush as a linebacker. I guess I just gotta trust Wade on this one... A bigger indication of whether he can pull it off IMO would be the 10 yard split, broad jump, and more importantly the 3 cone drill. All the good/great pass rushers from the stand up position generally have around either under 7 seconds or a bit above 7 seconds in the 3 cone drill, and around 10' on the broad. Which show body control and the ability to quickly change direction eating up as little space as possible, and explosion. IMO he can play the position because he fits the role athletically enough, but of course, I wouldn't trust him in dropping back for coverage. Edited May 6, 2011 by DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FIDDYDEUCE 81 Posted May 6, 2011 IMO he can play the position because he fits the role athletically enough, but of course, I wouldn't trust him in dropping back for coverage. That's about the only questionable aspect of this move. As you said he definitely has the athletics to be a complete force at 3-4 OLB but his coverage skills will be a liability. Luckily technique can be taught and Mario is a hard worker. Despite the move to OLB I do fully expect the Texans to run a 4-3 plays within their scheme (ala Ravens, Jets) to take full advantage of Mario's immense talent at DE. 3-4: DE: Watt 'NT': ?? DE: Smith ROLB: Williams LOLB: Barwin/Reed MLB1: Ryan MLB2: Cushing The Potential the have at 3-4 is insane. I have to agree with what Razor said in another thread; with all the pass rushers this team has I wouldn't be surprised if Mario lined up at the 0 tech. Texans will be very exciting to watch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted May 6, 2011 You guys are talking about how Williams has to drop back in coverage at some point. 1 It's going to be hard to throw over a 6'7" LB and 2 this will allow Houston to be a lot more creative in the way that they use their best player. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FartWaffles 1,857 Posted May 6, 2011 Per Rotoworld: Defensive Wade Phillips expects weak-side linebacker Mario Williams to be in coverage "about 5 percent" of the time. Phillips is comparing the 282-pound Williams to 262-pound All-Pro DeMarcus Ware, leading NFL Network -- among others -- to overreact to the position switch. Williams won't be used to cover Chris Johnson or Marcedes Lewis out of the backfield, though. Phillips will move him around, creating mismatches on the offensive line and using variations of the 3-4 where the weak-side linebacker essentially functions as a defensive end. Source: Houston Chronicle Okay, so even though he may have the title of a linebacker he's still basically going to be a defensive end. I'm guessing there will be some times where he's standing up, but I think for the most part he's going to be in his usual three-point stance. I'm not so worried about this anymore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vin+ 3,121 Posted May 6, 2011 According to Pro Football Focus, Mario Williams played 113 of his 793 snaps in a two-point stance last season. This is relevant because Mario will be rushing from a two-point stance on the majority of his snaps in Houston's new 3-4. Williams has experience in a linebacker-type role, and was plenty of productive. PFF suggests a comparison to Tamba Hali, who switched from 4-3 defensive end to 3-4 outside 'backer in Kansas City, and executed with flying colors. These players are strictly pass rushers. They don't try covering tight ends. Source: Pro Football Focus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241 Posted May 7, 2011 Personally, I don't see the reason for the switch in the first place, they were closer to having a very good 4-3 defense, then a 3-4... I think he'd be more productive from the 5 tech in a 1-gap defensive scheme on the weakside.... At 6'6 295, it becomes very easy to chop at those knees... Either way, Phillips' defense needs a pass rusher, and he's the most qualified... So this move is not surprising... Im really interested to see this play out. You guys are talking about how Williams has to drop back in coverage at some point. 1 It's going to be hard to throw over a 6'7" LB and 2 this will allow Houston to be a lot more creative in the way that they use their best player. 6'6* Teams don't do mismatches b/w receivers and tight ends because they want the receiver to outjump them, teams take advantage of big guys in coverage because they have big hips and can't turn and run with the quicker more agile receiver. Especially when they have to first drop back into a zone and then pick up an incoming receiver. He's only dropping back about 5% of the time, so this is all hypothetical. But if I was a team with a quicker receiver like the Vikings and Percy Harvin, and he was dropping back into coverage, i'd target him... because the chances he drops back into his correct zone and picks up the smaler quicker Harvin are slim... And the chances after doing all that that he could make the tackle if Harvin got that ball are even slimmer. Now if he drops a little bit of that weight... Then it's a different story... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RazorStar 4,025 Posted May 7, 2011 He doesn't even need to drop weight, all he needs to do is be a giant wall of "oh fuck get out my way". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FartWaffles 1,857 Posted May 9, 2011 He doesn't even need to drop weight, all he needs to do is be a giant wall of "oh fuck get out my way". That's what I'm thinking, and that's also why this report worries me a bit... Per Rotoworld: Mario Williams will try to lose 15-20 pounds as he switches from defensive end to outside linebacker. Wiliams is currently at 282 pounds and will try to get down to 265. While messing with one of the game's elite pass rushers seems odd, we suspect the move will actually help Williams get more sacks. He won't be asked to cover and will focus strictly on rushing the quarterback. Chiefs OLB Tamba Hali and Cowboys OLB DeMarcus Ware have been prolific in this exact role. Source: SI.com I'm hoping this is just speculation from Peter King... Though he does think it's a pretty good idea. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RANGA+ 1,210 Posted May 11, 2011 I think losing the weight is a good idea, if he's going to be in the two-point stance. It's a lot easier to block a 6'6" guy coming out of a two-point stance than it is to block a 6'2" or even a 6'4" guy, simply because of leverage. Losing that weight will give him a quicker burst out of the standup position, which will provide an advantage against the more agile tackles in the league. He probably doesn't need to lose 15-20 pounds though...5-10 would be more ideal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014 Posted May 11, 2011 Per Rotoworld: Okay, so even though he may have the title of a linebacker he's still basically going to be a defensive end. I'm guessing there will be some times where he's standing up, but I think for the most part he's going to be in his usual three-point stance. I'm not so worried about this anymore. Incorrect. He'll be in the 2-point stance, but he'll be rushing 95% of the time, meaning he'll be playing the same role of a 4-3 DE, but in a 3-4 LOLB role. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seanbrock 1,684 Posted May 11, 2011 Adalius Thomas had a lot of success as an OLB and he was 6'2", but he was also 270. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krawnka 282 Posted May 11, 2011 Either way, I hope he does well, and continues to prove the "experts" wrong, for criticizing him going #1 overall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FartWaffles 1,857 Posted May 13, 2011 Incorrect. He'll be in the 2-point stance, but he'll be rushing 95% of the time, meaning he'll be playing the same role of a 4-3 DE, but in a 3-4 LOLB role. Yeah, you're right Zack. Anyways here's a pretty good interview with Wade Phillips on how he plans on running the Texans defense, and he refers it to more of a 5-2 defense than anything. Interesting... Source: HoustonTexans.com Phillips clarifies plans for Williams in “5-2†front The Texans’ decision to move Mario Williams to outside linebacker has sparked plenty of hoopla and debate. Williams has been one of the most productive pass rushers in the NFL as a 4-3 defensive end, and he’ll be an unconventionally large linebacker at 6-6, 290 pounds. On Monday, defensive coordinator Wade Phillips said that Williams essentially will still be an end in his defense – he’ll just be on his feet more. “They say ‘3-4’, ‘4-3’, all that,†Phillips said at the Texans' annual Charity Golf Classic. “We really play a 5-2. We play five defensive linemen that can rush the passer and two inside 'backers who can tackle people. And we think Mario certainly fits in there.†In that 5-2 front, Williams will often be standing up on the right edge of the defensive line as the Will (weakside outside) linebacker. Along the line to Williams’ left will likely be Antonio Smith at right end, Earl Mitchell or Shaun Cody at nose tackle, J.J. Watt at left end and Connor Barwin or Brooks Reed at Sam (strongside outside) linebacker. Standing behind them will be inside linebackers DeMeco Ryans and Brian Cushing. “We have a lot of versatility,†Texans head coach Gary Kubiak said. “Cushing gives us a lot of versatility. Connor Barwin gives us a lot of versatility. If Mark Anderson… ends up being ours throughout this (free agency) process, he gives us versatility. “So we’ve got a lot of good athletes on the defensive side of the ball, and the combinations we just added to it (in the draft) with J.J. and Brooks and those guys give Wade a great a lot of great talent to work with. We’ll have to see how it all fits, but there’s a couple of guys that can play multiple positions.†Phillips often says that he fits his defense to the players, not the other way around. “The more you can do with players scheme-wise helps you,†he said. “We’re going to put Mario down some, but we’re not going to tell them when. And same thing with Cushing: We’re going to play him inside most of the time, but sometimes he’s going to be rushing outside.†Asked how much concern he has about Williams dropping into coverage, Phillips replied, “None.†“We’re not going to drop him,†Phillips said. “We’re going to rush him. That’s why I say we’re more of a 5-2, in that those five guys are coming a lot of the time, especially the position Mario plays. DeMarcus Ware played that position, Bryce Paup – on and on, guys that have led the league. They didn’t lead the league in sacks by dropping a whole lot.†Williams has 43.5 sacks since 2007, but he hasn't finished a season in the top-10 in sacks since 2008. Phillips said that he has coached outside linebackers who have led the league in sacks from both the Sam and Will positions. “We put (Williams) in the premier position,†Phillips said. “You’re rushing the passer more at Will, and so that’s where we put him. We were looking in the draft for the best pass rusher. Well, we had him on our team, and so we just moved him to that position rather than going the other way around.†Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zack_of_Steel+ 3,014 Posted May 13, 2011 We ran the 5-2 in high school. Sometimes the "DE" would be out in a 2-point and sometimes they'd be down in a 3-point. Interesting. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
