Jordan Peterson On the Wage Gap: Opinions Needed

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

I present you Jordan Peterson:

 

The reason I post this is because Peterson is receiving A LOT of backlash. Now, from a political and ideological stand point, I almost 100% agree with Peterson here so perhaps I am biased -- but I don't really see anything he does wrong.

I will save more of my opinion for after others watch the video because I don't want to taint your opinions.

But basically the news station has said that he (Peterson) has incited what amounts to an online riot and that he's responsible for threats and insults that this journalist is receiving. And because of that, they have had to hire extra security for here, blah blah blah.

So I want to know from you... What is Peterson at fault for here?

[Sarge+ 3,436]

Super interesting video... really. I'm not going to comment on it just yet. I want to watch it again tomorrow.

[RazorStar 4,025]

Peterson is at fault for being a man is kind of what this sounds like. The reporter is digging her own grave with her awful nonsensical remarks. She certainly doesn't deserve death threats, but she is being pretty willfully ignorant. I um... might have more thoughts later, I'm only 4 minutes into the video.

 

oh my god. Yes you need to know why the pay gap exists. You need to know why things are what they are, so that you can seek solutions rather than shake your fist.

Edited January 24, 2018 by RazorStar

[Thanatos 2,847]

I'm not really seeing the backlash, if anything its directed more at her because she's a complete moron here. Been following this story for awhile now.

 

Yeah there are some news outlets in Britain trying to spin this off as something its not, but the thing is, you have to understand Channel 4. This is what they do. They get a controversial person on the show, which Peterson definitely is, and then they proceed to grill them, basically in an attempt to get them flustered and angry, which any normal human would upon his words constantly being misconstrued.

 

It's tabloid journalism and should be shunned.

[OSUViking 505]

^It is absolutely ridiculous that Jordan Peterson is seen as controversial. The majority of what he says is stuff my doctors have shared with me. I'd imagine people don't like him because he annihilates the fantasy realities people come up with to excuse their own shortcomings.

 

Edit: just finished the video. Lady was insufferable. Won't go as far as saying she deserves some backlash (definitely not death threats), but if I'd been Peterson I'd have walked out. She was not interested in having discussion with him, she wanted to tell him he was wrong. Peterson 10/10

Edited January 24, 2018 by OSUViking

[Sarge+ 3,436]

That woman reminded me of the classic SJW. She listened to absolutely nothing he had to say. Her body language, her constant interruption of him to tell him he's making a point that he's really not making... and he wasn't saying anything remotely similar to any of the conclusions she was jumping to.

 

This woman was no match for him. Despite all her shit, he remained composed enough to maintain his logical approach to swat down every "I'm in my feelings in response to something you said" moment by her. He continuously told her that he believed gender is only 1 of the many reasons why women get paid less than men on average. She kept trying to say he's denying that there are obstacles or that the gap exists at all when he never said any of that, quite clearly.

 

I also like the moment at 22:00 and after. She asked him why freedom of speech trumps a person's right to be offended. He really nailed her there when he said in order to express freedom of speech you have to risk offense and he turned the tables on her to prove it. Truly, he had every right to be offended at her ridiculous, childish behavior. But he never let her get to him, and that bothered her more and more as the interview went on.

 

I also enjoyed how he complimented her for her success and showed her how he was right about almost everything he had said up to that point. She said she worked very hard to get where she was, and he asked why would someone NOT have to fight to get to the top? She ignored that and every other question he tried to ask her as a follow-up.

 

He did nothing wrong, unless you count destroying emotions with logic as being wrong. She grew increasingly unprofessional and petty as she realized that 1. He was right and 2. Her attempts at derailing him were utterly ineffective.

 

The moral of this video is people need to stop looking at things as though they are black and white. "Women get paid less than men! You're a sexist if you don't want to fix it!" It's not that simple, it never has been that simple, and it never will be that simple. People just can't accept that men and women are different... they (usually) have different personalities, they (usually) want different things and they (usually) go about getting those things in different ways.

 

And another thing that she absolutely never listened to or responded to was that he talked about how he helps women get stronger and negotiate pay raises. He has done more for inequality than she has, that's for sure. He can help people because he knows the real reasons why most people never have the success they should have. It has little to do with your gender and a whole lot to do with your personality and how you function as a person.

 

I really liked this video.

[Omerta+ 1,206]

This is why I am a strong advocate for men's rights. This dumb, useless, and baseless third wave feminism will end up getting a lot of people hurt. Imagine if a Man was interviewing this cunt and said,"Well, of course you got cat called, you dress like a whore and have seen every dick on the block." They would literally send the dude to jail in all likelihood for hate speech.

 

Flip it and this stupid twat gets to call a man who has scientifically analyzed his thoughts for the last 40 years every single name in the liberal playbook. He is a sexist, transphobic, white male who is putting the whole of society down. I truly hate feminism, and this is why.

 

The pay gap has been eradicated by everyone who is not too stupid to know the difference between earnings and wage. It is a myth, has not always been so, but for the better part of 10 years it most certainly has. And if you can imagine all those dumb cunts at the BBC who are giving women a bad name, saying they are illegally paying us less. Well how do you figure that out. That is the problem that Jordan Peterson eluded too. If a man gets more ratings he should get paid more, not because he is a man, but because his viewership is greater. You dont get to be a female weather anchor and expect to get paid as much as the guy who is the face of the network. Even if you are a female anchor and a man has 25 more years of experience and a higher viewership he is deserving of more money.

 

This is equality of outcome. Just because you are both anchors does not mean you should be paid the same. There are so many mitigating factors in that, it is impossible to arbitrarily judge worth. The same above goes for all men, if a woman makes more and she has higher viewership, it is how it should be. Feminists need to jump off a fuking cliff.

[Thanatos 2,847]

And that's why Jordan Peterson is a much better man than you or I, because he can do all this and not stoop to childish insults in response.

 

He doesn't hate feminism. He also never said the paygap is a myth, because its not, but there are varied reasons for it, not one single unilateral reason.

[BJORN 679]

Peterson is guilty of using logic and not attributing everything wrong in the world to discrimination.

 

This video pretty much sums up why today's politics is extremely tiresome for me. But it really does make me happy that there are people like Peterson actually taking a stand against this BS. The whole video she doesn't listen to a thing he says, she twists his meaning, projects his viewpoints to be something they are not, talks in absolutes, and has no answer other than "lol are you saying women are not as good as men?" Straight up inferiority complex. (Under talked about issue in society?)

 

"Right to not be offended" > "Freedom of speech" in the eyes of this woman. Enough said.

[OSUViking 505]

Frankly Ngata, men's rights uses THE EXACT same logic as radical feminism. Any group that pits the "us against them" narrative is toxic, and men's right activism does that in spades. Circumstances are always extremely complex and they fall into the same trap as feminists in thinking these complex issues have simple causes.

 

Peterson nailed it. Treat people fairly regardless of demographic. That's the goal. Fuck someone's identity, it really doesn't mean much.

[OSUViking 505]

And that's why Jordan Peterson is a much better man than you or I, because he can do all this and not stoop to childish insults in response.

 

He doesn't hate feminism. He also never said the paygap is a myth, because its not, but there are varied reasons for it, not one single unilateral reason.

I can only speak for myself, but if I'm saying it's a myth I mean that the notion it is entirely driven by gender is a myth. Saying that women are paid less because they are women is oversimplifying the issue, hence why I call the gender wage gap a myth.

[OSUViking 505]

Peterson is guilty of using logic and not attributing everything wrong in the world to discrimination.

 

This video pretty much sums up why today's politics is extremely tiresome for me. But it really does make me happy that there are people like Peterson actually taking a stand against this BS. The whole video she doesn't listen to a thing he says, she twists his meaning, projects his viewpoints to be something they are not, talks in absolutes, and has no answer other than "lol are you saying women are not as good as men?" Straight up inferiority complex. (Under talked about issue in society?)

 

"Right to not be offended" > "Freedom of speech" in the eyes of this woman. Enough said.

I think insecurity in general is not addressed. Just about everyone is insecure about something, and it drives so many people. The general emotional intelligence in the US is nothing short of pathetic. Seriously, spend a few months shoring up emotional competency and then you'll see how awful everyone else is.

 

Sarge talked about this in the Shoutbox. I'll save what he said for him if he chooses to share again, but it was relevant here. My own experience is from working to overcome my own issues, and now I see how toxic various friends and especially my family are.

[Sarge+ 3,436]

Here's the convo from last night in the shoutbox.

 

Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:36 PM)By the way... that video you posted was amazing. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:37 PM)Super interesting, thought-provoking shit. Olenna4Ever+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:45 PM)I thought so BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:45 PM)F4E: I haven't seen the video but I'm sure the gentlemen somehow offended all those keyboard warriors. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:46 PM)Unintentionally that is. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:46 PM)Hot take I'm going to say now that I probably never would have said before: I think most offense is unintended. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:47 PM)I agree. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:48 PM)Because of how bad the culture has gotten, you can't say anything without causing someone to rage. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:48 PM)And lately if you don't say anything, you'll get shit on for that too. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:49 PM)And someone with high self-esteem and plenty of confidence doesn't care about any of that. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:50 PM)Sarge: Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:51 PM)Funny, I've noticed that as my own levels of those qualities have risen, I seem to be making enemies with people who wallow in their self-pity. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:52 PM)I've my share of issues, and still do, mentally speaking. But one thing I don't have anymore is a victim mentality. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:52 PM)Yeah, it's like they want to drag you down with them or something. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:53 PM)And that's good Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:54 PM)I really think if I went back to the U.S. a lot of people I used to consider friends would hate me. And people I used to consider idiots or selfish would be the first people I would call to get a beer. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:56 PM)I moved to a country (and culture) where weakness is not tolerated. I was faced with a decision: adapt or perish. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:56 PM)Crazy how your perspectives change. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 10:56 PM)It has been rocky, but I'm finding my way. BigBen07 : (23 January 2018 - 10:57 PM)Sarge: Harder paths are always the most rewarding. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 11:01 PM)Becoming more assertive has not been easy, that's for sure. Sarge+ : (23 January 2018 - 11:02 PM)And I am still working on it.

[OSUViking 505]

^exactly that

 

I still struggle mightily in being assertive. But I don't victimize myself if something bad happens to me.

 

I was having a convo with my sister. She went to culinary school that was quite expensive, and all she does is complain about the loan system. Yeah I get it, loans suck. But who created those circumstances? Her. She refuses to accept that this is a consequence of going to culinary school in a culture that DOES NOT value trade or vocational schools. It's unbearable being around her and others I used to love being around because they just complain about people fucking them over. That used to be me too, lol. Fuck that. It's revolting if you see it happen every time you talk to someone.

Edited January 24, 2018 by OSUViking

[Sarge+ 3,436]

I've noticed that my interpersonal communication skills have been skyrocketing lately. I also am noticing my popularity rising again. These things were not my intention when I decided to truly dedicate myself to changing, but I am not going to complain. Most people really don't enjoy spending time around the "woe is me" attitude.

 

Here's another thing. I don't just want success and happiness for myself. I want others to get it, too. But I can't do it for them. And I regret that I ever expected others to do it for me, too.

 

 

“Not I, nor anyone else can travel that road for you.
You must travel it by yourself.
It is not far. It is within reach.
Perhaps you have been on it since you were born, and did not know.
Perhaps it is everywhere - on water and land.”

 

- Walt Whitman

[Omerta+ 1,206]

Frankly Ngata, men's rights uses THE EXACT same logic as radical feminism. Any group that pits the "us against them" narrative is toxic, and men's right activism does that in spades. Circumstances are always extremely complex and they fall into the same trap as feminists in thinking these complex issues have simple causes.

 

Peterson nailed it. Treat people fairly regardless of demographic. That's the goal. Fuck someone's identity, it really doesn't mean much.

 

Frankly Ngata, men's rights uses THE EXACT same logic as radical feminism. Any group that pits the "us against them" narrative is toxic, and men's right activism does that in spades. Circumstances are always extremely complex and they fall into the same trap as feminists in thinking these complex issues have simple causes.

 

Peterson nailed it. Treat people fairly regardless of demographic. That's the goal. Fuck someone's identity, it really doesn't mean much.

 

Frankly Ngata, men's rights uses THE EXACT same logic as radical feminism. Any group that pits the "us against them" narrative is toxic, and men's right activism does that in spades. Circumstances are always extremely complex and they fall into the same trap as feminists in thinking these complex issues have simple causes.

 

Peterson nailed it. Treat people fairly regardless of demographic. That's the goal. Fuck someone's identity, it really doesn't mean much.

 

100% agree. You wont get an argument out of me. That said when it comes down to it, what do we do? Doing nothing is what lets radical feminism take hold. It just seems to me you get nowhere from arguing from the middle. To me this is just cause and effect. For every action there will be equal and opposite.

 

Also to frame what I think is mens rights. I think to me it is more about holding a mirror up to the hypocrisy of feminism. The whole god damn thing is such a contradiction and to say,"If you think it is so god damn easy being a white male how come you are not advocating for things like longer prison sentences for women? Or registering for the draft? OR why dont you have anything but your feelings to back up your narrative? Or when that is pointed out you just shrill and call names? " It really just makes no sense to me and I think men have gotten to the point where we are tired of hearing this bullshit narrative. Right now I think society is truly about as fair as it will get for genders. There is no real way to make it more equitable in a way that is applicable on anything larger than an individual basis.

 

When it comes to legislation you cant legislate for individuals so what do you want? I am not advocaitng for beating women, or keeping them from anything. Just realize that maybe the grass isnt so green on this side, or maybe it is fairly green on both. I still cant figure out what feminists REALLY want? They say equality, well equality of what? Liek specific examples that aren't bad math or science like the wage gap.

[BwareDWare94 723]

One cannot be controversial if one is correct.

 

Jordan Peterson is the voice of reason we need in 2018

[BwareDWare94 723]

The wage gap might factually exist numerically, but what causes it is factors that are in no way patriarchal, but coincidental.

[OSUViking 505]

 

Also to frame what I think is mens rights. I think to me it is more about holding a mirror up to the hypocrisy of feminism. The whole god damn thing is such a contradiction and to say,"If you think it is so god damn easy being a white male how come you are not advocating for things like longer prison sentences for women? Or registering for the draft? OR why dont you have anything but your feelings to back up your narrative? Or when that is pointed out you just shrill and call names? " It really just makes no sense to me and I think men have gotten to the point where we are tired of hearing this bullshit narrative. Right now I think society is truly about as fair as it will get for genders. There is no real way to make it more equitable in a way that is applicable on anything larger than an individual basis.

 

When it comes to legislation you cant legislate for individuals so what do you want? I am not advocaitng for beating women, or keeping them from anything. Just realize that maybe the grass isnt so green on this side, or maybe it is fairly green on both. I still cant figure out what feminists REALLY want? They say equality, well equality of what? Liek specific examples that aren't bad math or science like the wage gap.

I can understand your logic, but personally I can't support MRA.

 

I tend to agree that in terms of legislation, there's not much else to do. Comes down to people treating others with respect regardless of demographic, and that's something culture needs to address. Considering how people plan to address the issues they see, it seems that we are a very long way off from basic respect between individuals.

[BwareDWare94 723]

On men's rights--it should be more about not losing rights than anything.

[Thanatos 2,847]

One cannot be controversial if one is correct.

 

Jordan Peterson is the voice of reason we need in 2018

 

I'm not talking about in this video, but he has definitely aired some controversial views in the past.

[Sarge+ 3,436]

I can understand your logic, but personally I can't support MRA.

 

I tend to agree that in terms of legislation, there's not much else to do. Comes down to people treating others with respect regardless of demographic, and that's something culture needs to address. Considering how people plan to address the issues they see, it seems that we are a very long way off from basic respect between individuals.

 

We need more assertiveness as a culture. No more playing the passive-aggressive victim card.

[BwareDWare94 723]

 

I'm not talking about in this video, but he has definitely aired some controversial views in the past.

I haven't heard any as of yet. His opposition to Bill C-16 should not have been seen as controversial.

[Sarge+ 3,436]

I haven't heard any as of yet. His opposition to Bill C-16 should not have been seen as controversial.

 

Everything that opposes victimization and the PC zeitgeist is seen as controversial.

[BwareDWare94 723]

Gotta love our PC culture. If we don't refer to fruitcakes as Xe or Xer we're practicing hate speech!

Edited January 27, 2018 by BwareDWare94