Von Miller or Aldon Smith?

[AllYouNeedIsLovie 377]

Both are having insane rookie years and are putting up big sack numbers. Who would you rather have on your team though? I'd go with Von Miller because as of now, Smith isn't an every down player and I'd like to see how he does as an every down player before I consider him better than Miller.

[KiLaSix9+ 398]

Von Miller is an every down player. He can stop the run, rush the passer and is learning to cover. He's an all around linebacker that has an extremely high ceiling. Right now, Aldon Smith is a pure pass rusher. He's damn good at it and will quickly become a feared member of that team but I like a guy like Justin Smith better on that D because he can and does make a play on downs 1-3 while Aldon is only accountable on third down.

[seanbrock 1,684]

Von Miller is arguably already the best player at his position in the league. I don't think high ceiling quite describes it. Miller and JPP are the next generation of elite players.

[Bay 2,003]

If I'm a 3-4 Aldon. If I'm a 4-3 Von.

[KiLaSix9+ 398]

Von Miller is arguably already the best player at his position in the league. I don't think high ceiling quite describes it. Miller and JPP are the next generation of elite players.

Ah yes JPP is a beast. Now THAT guy is a DE that plays hard on every down. Run stuffer and pas rusher extraordinaire.

Edited December 21, 2011 by KiLaSix9

[Shotgun 442]

Since Bucs are a 4-3 I'd have to go with Von Miller. Even if it was a 3-4 it would be a difficult decision. Von is just an all around great player.

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

I'd take Aldon regardless of scheme.

[Plax 4 Prez 21]

2 weeks ago I would've said Von Miller, but now it's pretty close to call. If the 49ers get the 2nd seed with bye, and if the Broncos somehow self destruct and miss out of the playoffs I think you have to go with Smith. Just my opinion

[seanbrock 1,684]

Von Miller has been stuck on a slapped together defense. I mean, lets face it. Fox hasn't exactly had a lot of time to bring his guys in. Miller along with Brodrick Bunkley and Champ Bailey have the Broncos poised to bring home the first division title in quite some time for a team that has a very one dimensional offense. I don't think saying because the 49ers are taking the 2nd seed so Smith should win. Von Miller is a LB with a skill set that I don't even know who to compare to from guys I've seen personally. It's tough to get double digit sacks as a 4-3 OLB but what's most impressive is he's dominant against the run and very solid in coverage. Honestly without the pass rushing skill he's still a top tier 4-3 OLB. If Miller was rushing as much as Smith and playing behind Justing Miller he'd have A LOT of sacks.

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

Von Miller has been stuck on a slapped together defense. I mean, lets face it. Fox hasn't exactly had a lot of time to bring his guys in. Miller along with Brodrick Bunkley and Champ Bailey have the Broncos poised to bring home the first division title in quite some time for a team that has a very one dimensional offense. I don't think saying because the 49ers are taking the 2nd seed so Smith should win. Von Miller is a LB with a skill set that I don't even know who to compare to from guys I've seen personally. It's tough to get double digit sacks as a 4-3 OLB but what's most impressive is he's dominant against the run and very solid in coverage. Honestly without the pass rushing skill he's still a top tier 4-3 OLB. If Miller was rushing as much as Smith and playing behind Justing Miller he'd have A LOT of sacks.

 

Your over-exaggerating. Von Miller is NOT dominant against the run, especially if you compare him to other dominant run defenders at 4-3 OLB.

 

And it may be tough for a 4-3 OLB to get double digit sacks, but it because 10x easier when your a pass rush specialist and you rush the QB 260 times more then your dropping back in coverage on a pass play, and you've rushed the QB more times then you've played the run. Hell, he's even rushed the QB more times then Smith and Smith still has more sacks and pressures.

 

Von Miller has been very good this season, but to say that he has been the best at his position this season is crazy. You strip away his sacks and pressures and you have an above average season for a 4-3 OLB. He may have potential to eventually be there, but he isn't there, and he's got a long way to go before you can even make a claim saying he's 'dominant' in any facet of his game that's not pass rush.

Edited December 21, 2011 by DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F

[RANGA+ 1,210]

If I'm a 3-4 Aldon. If I'm a 4-3 Von.

 

This. Both are gonna be superstars in this league either way.

[KiLaSix9+ 398]

Your over-exaggerating. Von Miller is NOT dominant against the run, especially if you compare him to other dominant run defenders at 4-3 OLB.

 

And it may be tough for a 4-3 OLB to get double digit sacks, but it because 10x easier when your a pass rush specialist and you rush the QB 260 times more then your dropping back in coverage on a pass play, and you've rushed the QB more times then you've played the run. Hell, he's even rushed the QB more times then Smith and Smith still has more sacks and pressures.

 

Von Miller has been very good this season, but to say that he has been the best at his position this season is crazy. You strip away his sacks and pressures and you have an above average season for a 4-3 OLB. He may have potential to eventually be there, but he isn't there, and he's got a long way to go before you can even make a claim saying he's 'dominant' in any facet of his game that's not pass rush.

And if you strip away Aldon Smith's sacks and pressures, hes not even in this conversation. Von Miller is the starting OLB whos out there on every snap while Aldon Smith is in a rotation and is only being asked to come in on certain plays and get after the QB. It makes your job a lot easier when you have the luxury of playing in a talented group of defenders with enough depth to only have you come in and focus on one assignment.

[JetsFan4Life 542]

If you take away Justin Smith and the attention he brings how good is Aldon Smith? I think you have to factor that into this right now as well. Both players are definitely great but Von Miller is playing out of his mind in my opinion.

[BwareDWare94 723]

It goes to the every down player. Even if Von Miller has two good linebackers next to him, Aldon Smith has a great DL and the best 1-2 package of MLB's in the game behind him. He can rush because they will tackle. You have to factor that in.

[ATL_Predator+ 1,196]

If you take away Justin Smith and the attention he brings how good is Aldon Smith? I think you have to factor that into this right now as well. Both players are definitely great but Von Miller is playing out of his mind in my opinion.

This^

 

This year the rookie class continues to blow my mind with Newton, Dareus, Dalton, Julio, Patrick Peterson, and AJ Green...along with the brutal progression of Gabbert and Ponder.

[Thanatos 2,847]

This^

 

This year the rookie class continues to blow my mind with Newton, Dareus, Dalton, Julio, Patrick Peterson, and AJ Green...along with the brutal progression of Gabbert and Ponder.

 

I wouldn't count out Gabbert just yet, and I certainly wouldn't count out Ponder. He's actually doing pretty good for a rookie, its just Dalton and Cam are doing ridiculous, so it kinda raised the bar for rookie QBs. Ponder should be fine, like Gabbert, remember, he has no weapons except for his running-back. And Percy Harvin, I guess, but that might explain why he has better numbers than Gabbert.

[KiLaSix9+ 398]

I like what I've seen from Ponder this season. Am I just looking through my FSU shades? Maybe.

[ATL_Predator+ 1,196]

I wouldn't count out Gabbert just yet, and I certainly wouldn't count out Ponder. He's actually doing pretty good for a rookie, its just Dalton and Cam are doing ridiculous, so it kinda raised the bar for rookie QBs. Ponder should be fine, like Gabbert, remember, he has no weapons except for his running-back. And Percy Harvin, I guess, but that might explain why he has better numbers than Gabbert.

Never said I was counting them out...just said that they are getting Sandusky'd by their offensive lines.

[seanbrock 1,684]

This^

 

This year the rookie class continues to blow my mind with Newton, Dareus, Dalton, Julio, Patrick Peterson, and AJ Green...along with the brutal progression of Gabbert and Ponder.

Danny Watkins

[BwareDWare94 723]

Ponder has been playing very well. If he has protection and a running game that shows up, he looks like a veteran most of the time. He has good command of the offense and shows great on-field leadership. It's just that he's still going to make rookie mistakes and people are acting like he shouldn't make those mistakes. Better now than year 2. He'll really take off next year if they get him more weapons and fix this sieve of an offensive line. They need new tackles. Hutch is OK, still, and Herrera is dece. They just need to replace the useless oafs on the outside. Neither Charlie Johnson or Phil Loadholt should be in the NFL next year.

Edited December 21, 2011 by BwareDWare94

[DonovanMcnabb for H.O.F 2,241]

And if you strip away Aldon Smith's sacks and pressures, hes not even in this conversation. Von Miller is the starting OLB whos out there on every snap while Aldon Smith is in a rotation and is only being asked to come in on certain plays and get after the QB. It makes your job a lot easier when you have the luxury of playing in a talented group of defenders with enough depth to only have you come in and focus on one assignment.

 

sb was making a claim that Von Miller was already one of, if not the best at his position. Which isn't true, because sacks aside, there is no other facet of his game that screams, dominant. He isn't dominant against the run when you compare him to other SAM backers, and he certainly isn't one of the best at his position in coverage. So making that kind of a claim has no warrant since the only area where he has been dominant is pass rushing in comparison to other 4-3 OLBs. And he has done that (rush the QB) a lot more then anybody else at his position.

 

But with that said, Von Miller has rushed the QB more times then Smith, yet he has less sacks and less pressures then Smith. Whether or not Smith is a situational pass rusher this season or not, how can that be ignored?

[RazorStar 4,025]

Well it could because of the vast number of proven players on San Frans D that you have to key in on. Patrick Willis, NaVarro Bowman, Ahmad Brooks, Parys Haralson is a good pass rusher, Ray McDonald and Justin Smith have both been ridiculous this year... Aldon Smith kind of gets lost in the shuffle. Our pass rush in Dumervil and Von Miller, nobody else really make an impact pass rushing.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

Definitely go with Von Miller. I LOVE Aldon Smith. LOVE the kid. He is so good already and I honestly don't think he has a ceiling. He's just going to get better and better, imo.

 

However. Watching Von Miller play just makes my jaw drop. It's like... This kid is a rookie? He's so good... And it isn't just in one area. He is a jack of all trades type of LB... And it pains me to say it, but its like what Sean said earlier in the thread.... I can't even remember a LB looking like. Granted, I'm only 21.... But Miller could turn out to be one of those once in a lifetime kind of players...

[KiLaSix9+ 398]

sb was making a claim that Von Miller was already one of, if not the best at his position. Which isn't true, because sacks aside, there is no other facet of his game that screams, dominant. He isn't dominant against the run when you compare him to other SAM backers, and he certainly isn't one of the best at his position in coverage. So making that kind of a claim has no warrant since the only area where he has been dominant is pass rushing in comparison to other 4-3 OLBs. And he has done that (rush the QB) a lot more then anybody else at his position.

 

But with that said, Von Miller has rushed the QB more times then Smith, yet he has less sacks and less pressures then Smith. Whether or not Smith is a situational pass rusher this season or not, how can that be ignored?

I'm not ready to call Miller one of the best or the best but he is on his way there and most offenses are already pegging him as the guy they have to focus on where as, like Razor said, Aldon Smith is not even the 3rd or 4th best guy on that defense. That makes a difference.

 

I'm curious to know where you found their individual stats for rushes and pressures. I tried looking for myself but couldn't find. Even with that evidence though, that only proves the point that Aldon Smith is a better pass rusher because with fewer rushes he has more sacks. I wouldn't argue that Miller is a better pass rusher. My point was that the reason Aldon Smith is so effective IS because hes a pass rushing specialist.

 

Like I said, I wasn't able to find those stats. If Aldon Smith, being brought in to rush the QB, has rushed the QB less times than Miller this season, then yes that is impressive when comparing the two.

[Favre4Ever+ 4,476]

According to PFF

 

Von Miller is by far and away the best 43 OLB in the league (this season). He's the best pass rusher, 2nd best in coverage (although allowing a QB rating of 120 throwing in his direction), and best in stopping the run. He has 12 sacks, 19 QB hits, and 28 pressures. He hasn't missed a tackle yet (the only 43 OLB to not miss a tackle out of 44 qualifying players) and has made 40 defensive stops (defined as a solo defensive tackle that results in an offensive failure).

 

Aldon Smith is the 2nd best 34 OLB, a little ways behind Cameron Wake, and barely edging out Tamba Hali. He's 2nd in pass rushing, 7th in coverage, and 14th against the run amongst other players at his position. He has 14 sacks, 12 QB hits, and 30 pressures. He also hasn't missed a tackle (the only 34 OLB to not record a missed tackle of the 29 qualifying 34 OLB), and has made 22 defensive stops.

 

Also... Be aware that Von Miller has logged 823 defensive snaps thus far, while Aldon Smith has a mere 446.

 

Thus....

 

Von Miller - 1 sack every 69 plays, 1 QB hit every 44 snaps, 1 QB Pressure every 30 snaps, and a defensive stop every 21 snaps

 

Aldon Smith - 1 sack every 32 snaps, 1 QB hit every 38 snaps, 1 QB pressure every 15 snaps, and a defensive stop every 21 snaps.

 

 

Von Miller has rushed the passer on 365 of his 823 defensive snaps (44.3%), Aldon Smith has rushed the passer on 309 of his 446 (69.2%) defensive snaps

 

 

Therefore... (defensive stops isn't just a pass rush stat, therefore it is excluded here)

 

Von Miller - 1 sack every 31 pass rush attempts, 1 QB hit every 20 pass rush attempts, and 1 QB pressure every 14 pass rush attempts

 

Aldon Smith - 1 sack every 23 times sent rushing the passer, 1 QB hit every 26 pass rush attempts, and 1 QB pressure every 11 pass rush attempts.

Edited December 22, 2011 by Favre4Ever